Want to learn about Trophy Hunting

Ethan Archibald · Jul 18, 2019

Hi I am new to this forum. I made this account mostly to learn about and gain perspective on aspects of trophy hunting. I think it goes without saying that there have been many social media incidents in regards to trophy hunting. With this in mind I would like to learn more about it.

Before going further I would just like to make it known that I am not a hunter. I am not opposed to it, its just something that was never part of my upbringing. I please ask you to take this into consideration. I have no intention of trying to criticize anyone, I just want to try and understand.

Now back to business. I guess what interests me the most is the subject of big game hunting. This always seems to cause the most trouble so I felt like pursing this topic first. I'm not opposed to it. I know that the much of costs associated with it go towards conversations and the economies of the countries the hunt takes place in. I understand this and do not have a problem with this. I know that it is also a form of population control. I guess my question is what motivated one to pay the money to go to Africa to hunt something like a Lion. I also would like to know what the process of the hunt is like. I mean, I think the animals are pre -determined to be hunted. I could be wrong. Is there like a period of finding the animal shooting it, or is it more like you know where the animals is, go to it, shoot it, and do whatever happens next.

I guess I ask this cause I have a bit of a romanticized view of what hunting should be like. Pretty much the hunting scenes from "The Deer Hunter". I guess what I'm saying is if the hunt is just being taken to the animal so you could shoot it, I don't see how its worth it. Is there a higher reason to pay tens of thousands of dollars to kill an animal?

With that question out of the way, I would also like to know about a bit about hunter involvement. I know, or at least I think I know, that these hunts are often conducted through some sort of agencies. However, I know that sometimes these hunts are not exactly clean and legal. Think the Cecil the Lion incident a few years back. To what degree do hunters go to make sure everything is done proper? Is there some standard that is expected to be lived up too?

If anyone could shed some light on these topics I would appreciate it. Please be respectful. This is not my usual area so I know I most certainly have made mistakes in language and terminology surrounding the subject. As I said before I do not wish to argue or criticize, I just want to try and gain understanding.

Witold KrzyÅ¼anowski · Jul 18, 2019

Welcome to AH.
Good luck and all the best.

Shootist43 · Jul 18, 2019

Ethan, we are always leery of answering posts like yours. I think the PC term is "trolling" but I'm not sure. All animals (including humans) are by nature either a "hunter" or "prey." The two groups are identified by the location of their eyes. The "hunter's" eyes face forward, the eyes of "prey" face toward the side. Meaning no disrespect, where are yours? But to answer your question, most "Trophy Hunting" which by the way is a disparaging term to most of us results in the removal of older males i.e. beyond their peak productive years from free roaming, self sustaining herds of animals. We get to keep the cape providing it is legal to do so and the locals get the meat that they so badly need. BTW almost all of us eat a portion of the animals we harvest.

BSO Dave · Jul 18, 2019

@Ethan Archibald,

Every once in a while we get a post like yours here and 99.9% of the time it is from an anti-hunting troll.... No disrespect to you, but some of your commentary reeks of a troll...

If you are not a hunter now, nobody's words here are going to convince or justify the reasons we hunters have for the love and passion of the hunt and the appreciation of the natural resources on this planet. These are things you must experience for yourself to understand.... I hope some day you get that chance. Secondly, the purpose of this site is to have a forum for like-minded folks to share information and experiences. This site does not exist to justify our positions to non-hunters.

What you can learn here are the multitude of both tangible and intangible contributions hunters make toward conservation of both species and their habitat world-wide. You can also learn about the incredible positive impact that hunter's dollars make towards employing and feeding countless families that would otherwise have no means to make a living if legal, sustainable, hunting did not exist in their regions.

A good place to start would be the Articles section located in the top task bar. Do some self-assigned research, and then ask your questions. You will find the members of this forum to be both extremely courteous and helpful provided that you prove your intentions to be sincere. I would also suggest refraining from making demands that members here be respectful to your inquiries. You are the new outsider here that needs to earn that respect.

Ethan Archibald · Jul 18, 2019

Hello all. Thank you for some of your initial replies. Looking at some of what has been said I would just like to try and say I am in no way trying to be a troll. I readily admit that a bunch of the PC anti hunting crowd are total whack jobs who cowardly hide behind their keyboards. I really do just want gain insight on the subject. I don't really know what else to say. I hope you all believe my intentions are pure. Of course I can't really do much to prove otherwise.

Shootist43 · Jul 18, 2019

Ethan, one of our members "Hoas" regularly posts articles that should be of great interest to you. Just do a search for "Hoas" (the box is in the upper right hand corner of the home page) Please let us know what you think of the articles he posts.

Mort Hill · Jul 18, 2019

I’ll take the bait Ethan.

My hunting started early like many other activities(ie fishing, baseball, plastic models, etc) with my Uncle introducing me through first clay targets, the dove and quail, squirrels and rabbits, then deer. We ate what we killed and caught, and I was taught how to safely handle firearms, bow and arrows, and how to be a good steward to wildlife.

Fast forward through the decades, and I began to explore interesting places and different species. I wound up hunting deer up north and in Texas. My first big game other than deer was a bear in Canada, then caribou in Alaska, then elk out west. That just fueled the desire to see more of this world, and do so through hunting.

After reading many books about Africa, the game, and hunting on the Dark Continent, I finally was able to afford to go on my first safari. It was all I could have imagined, and more. I went for the hunting experience, but came to appreciate the flora and fauna, the rural people, the history of Africa and more. I also answered that inner call, that desire if you would, to pursue those African species that can kill you as well, the dangerous game. The learning process of hunting something that can kill you to me was all part of the experience. I read volumes, practiced my skills, searched out knowledge to insure I would be the best hunter I could for these specific animals. I was and have been. It required financial discipline to acquire the tools of the trade. It also required hard work as well to save money for the trips.

In the end, I think it is a journey that either takes root in our DNA or does not.

I have two grown adopted sons. One of them hunts and fishes for sport. The other one does not. Both pretty much raised under the same model of parenting, so you tell me, what was the difference? To me it is just wiring.

I got nothing against those who do not hunt. No malice or ill will. I personally do not understand it because I am not wired that way. To me it is second nature. Instinct. Common sense. Like farming, you rotate crops. You can’t plant the same crop year after year without supplementing the soil or you ruin the land.

Last disclaimer. This is all in the context of legal, ethical hunting. Conservation. Not poaching, not killing just to kill for the thrill.

Philip Glass · Jul 18, 2019

Ethan Archibald said:
Hi I am new to this forum. I made this account mostly to learn about and gain perspective on aspects of trophy hunting. I think it goes without saying that there have been many social media incidents in regards to trophy hunting. With this in mind I would like to learn more about it.

Before going further I would just like to make it known that I am not a hunter. I am not opposed to it, its just something that was never part of my upbringing. I please ask you to take this into consideration. I have no intention of trying to criticize anyone, I just want to try and understand.

Now back to business. I guess what interests me the most is the subject of big game hunting. This always seems to cause the most trouble so I felt like pursing this topic first. I'm not opposed to it. I know that the much of costs associated with it go towards conversations and the economies of the countries the hunt takes place in. I understand this and do not have a problem with this. I know that it is also a form of population control. I guess my question is what motivated one to pay the money to go to Africa to hunt something like a Lion. I also would like to know what the process of the hunt is like. I mean, I think the animals are pre -determined to be hunted. I could be wrong. Is there like a period of finding the animal shooting it, or is it more like you know where the animals is, go to it, shoot it, and do whatever happens next.

I guess I ask this cause I have a bit of a romanticized view of what hunting should be like. Pretty much the hunting scenes from "The Deer Hunter". I guess what I'm saying is if the hunt is just being taken to the animal so you could shoot it, I don't see how its worth it. Is there a higher reason to pay tens of thousands of dollars to kill an animal?

With that question out of the way, I would also like to know about a bit about hunter involvement. I know, or at least I think I know, that these hunts are often conducted through some sort of agencies. However, I know that sometimes these hunts are not exactly clean and legal. Think the Cecil the Lion incident a few years back. To what degree do hunters go to make sure everything is done proper? Is there some standard that is expected to be lived up too?

If anyone could shed some light on these topics I would appreciate it. Please be respectful. This is not my usual area so I know I most certainly have made mistakes in language and terminology surrounding the subject. As I said before I do not wish to argue or criticize, I just want to try and gain understanding.

There is much already on AH that has been written to answer your questions. First of all the Cecil incident was perfectly legal and the court so ruled. You must understand the mainstream media is against hunting and they routinely lie.
If you watch Trophy the film you will get some of my personal perspective on the issues you bring up. www.trophythefilm.com
Ethics are a personal thing and I know you will find most everyone on AH to be very ethical in their approach to hunting.
Welcome to AH.
Philip

Ethan Archibald · Jul 18, 2019

Shootist43 said:
Ethan, one of our members "Hoas" regularly posts articles that should be of great interest to you. Just do a search for "Hoas" (the box is in the upper right hand corner of the home page) Please let us know what you think of the articles he posts.

Thank you for your suggestion. I did look at a few articles and found them interesting. I am pretty familiar with concept of hunting as a means of conservation and providing benefits for the community. I live really close to Valley Forge National Parka and for a while there was an overpopulation of white tail deer. This harmed the the landscape of the park and also led to many sickly deer. Eventually a culling program was instituted to decrease the population. This led to visibly healthier deer and a repaired landscape. The meat from the deer was also donated to various causes. Overall I just would like to say I agree with idea of hunting as a means of conservation

Ethan Archibald · Jul 18, 2019

Philip Glass said:
There is much already on AH that has been written to answer your questions. First of all the Cecil incident was perfectly legal and the court so ruled. You must understand the mainstream media is against hunting and they routinely lie.
If you watch Trophy the film you will get some of my personal perspective on the issues you bring up. www.trophythefilm.com
Ethics are a personal thing and I know you will find most everyone on AH to be very ethical in their approach to hunting.
Welcome to AH.
Philip

Thank you for your suggestions. Just to clear anything up I only used the Cecil incident because it was the highest profile case I could think of. I am well aware that no news source is ever free of bias and that they will always twist any and all information to fit their agenda. I don't really remember all the details, just that I thought I remembered that some part of it was lawfully in the gray area. To be honest the thing that bothered me most of all about the whole thing was the he didn't kill Cecil quickly. He shot him with an arrow and then after a few hours shot and killed him with another arrow. I don't know if he had to use arrows but if I was going to kill an animal I would want to do it quickly and painlessly. Just my two cents

southern_fowler · Jul 18, 2019

IMO, “Trophy Hunting “ is a term used by anti hunting organizations to make it seem like when someone goes “ trophy hunting “ they are just there to kill an animal for sport or a mount on their wall. I do not “trophy hunt”, I just go hunting whether it’s dove in Texas or elephant in Africa. What no one outside of the people that have actually been to another country sees is that all of the animal is used, it feeds the people and it puts a roof over their head and clothes on their backs in the form of dollars. The thing that pisses me off the most about the anti’s is they see a dead animal and just assume we skin it and kick the rest off into a ditch to rot, just because you do not eat lion, elephant, or giraffe meat doesn’t mean the rest of the world doesn’t.

JimP · Jul 18, 2019

Anymore I consider myself a trophy hunter, but that definition is different to me than to most.

I don't need to hunt for the meat but I do enjoy it. On my safari to Africa all I brought home was the "trophies" of the hunt. However all of the meat from the animals that I shot was consumed by humans. I do wish that I could of brought home some of the meat from each animal but due to federal regulations it is prohibited. There is also the fact that most of those complaining about "trophy hunting" have no idea of what becomes of the meat. They just spout off saying whatever they think is what is going on. Hopefully you will come to the correct outcome of what we as hunters do.

Back here in the US I do hunt for the largest animal that I can find anymore. But either I or my family gets the meat and none of it goes to waste. Also most states have a law on the books against the waste of game meat and the penalties are more than just a slap on the wrist. Take Alaska as a example, on a game animal all of the meat has to be brought out before the "trophy" parts of the animal are brought out on the last trip. This may mean a couple of days of packing meat out before you bring out the antlers or horns. Here in Colorado they passed a law that says that the meat needs to be consumed from all game animals. There are a few that the requirement doesn't cover but very few.

tigris115 · Jul 18, 2019

Also, if you need data or things that summarize it, look here

https://pastebin.com/zBYBCbpS

Philip Glass · Jul 22, 2019

Ethan Archibald said:
Thank you for your suggestions. Just to clear anything up I only used the Cecil incident because it was the highest profile case I could think of. I am well aware that no news source is ever free of bias and that they will always twist any and all information to fit their agenda. I don't really remember all the details, just that I thought I remembered that some part of it was lawfully in the gray area. To be honest the thing that bothered me most of all about the whole thing was the he didn't kill Cecil quickly. He shot him with an arrow and then after a few hours shot and killed him with another arrow. I don't know if he had to use arrows but if I was going to kill an animal I would want to do it quickly and painlessly. Just my two cents

Ethan I agree with you on bow hunting DG. I can’t say that too loudly on a hunting forum!
Let me know your thought on Trophy the film. Feel free to PM
PG

LivingTheDream · Jul 22, 2019

@Ethan Archibald just wondering but what are your hobbies and what are you passionate about? Do you like adventure and the unknown?

I think I can better answer your question if I can relate it back to what your interests are.

Scott CWO · Jul 22, 2019

On a hunt, the specific individual animal to be hunted is not predetermined. We don’t just walk up and shoot an animal with someone who has been waiting for us to arrive. The animals are on the move going from several different feeding areas to several different bedding areas and back and forth all the time. That’s where the challenge comes in. It’s a HUNT, not a KILL

Also, the trophy term is misused my the media. Most of us are looking for older animals that have done their biological job already by having bred several years or times. Some of the older animals have even been forced out of breeding by younger, stronger males. In the wild, older male lions are either killed by younger, stronger males or starve to death because they have trouble catching game. It’s not Walt Disney out there.

Many people that don’t hunt also don’t realize that it’s not a zero sum issue. With most species, the adult females breed every year. Can you imagine what the human population would be if every woman had a child every year? Some animals have multiple offspring every year - twins, liters, etc... Therefore, an older mature male being taken by a hunter makes no difference to the population growth. In the wild, male animals are not needed on a 1:1 ratio with females. One male can breed many females.

Hogpatrol · Jul 22, 2019

The best way to understand hunting is to experience it. No amount of expounding on the pros and cons on a forum, in print or video can fully explain the mindset of the hunter, be it in one's own country or overseas. The word visceral comes to mind.

Want to learn about Trophy Hunting

Ethan Archibald

Witold KrzyÅ¼anowski

Shootist43

BSO Dave

Ethan Archibald

Shootist43

Mort Hill

Philip Glass

Ethan Archibald

Ethan Archibald

southern_fowler

JimP

tigris115

Philip Glass

LivingTheDream

Scott CWO

Hogpatrol

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