Is this common... lose 100 % of your deposit

years ago, for my first trip, I had asked Marius (KMG) about trip insurance in case of some problem.
His response was "Don't do it for the deposit with me because the deposit was only half the day fees and we'll just roll it to another date anyway."

With that said, if you are going to have to reschedule, consider KMG.

To be fair it is a double edged sword .......if you signed a contract ....you signed a contract ....

If you cant make it ...... lodges have a small season and costs to cover whether you arrive or not ..........

Some of the comments on here to be honest of the name and shame type are little more than cyber bullying .......

If the operation is small maybe they could not take the hit ......in my early 20's guided in the UK and Bulgaria ........ there are 2 sides and certainly I took a few financial hits that I should not have ....


However if the contract was signed and the terms stated so be it ......

I know and see a few outfitters who I hunt with taking hits from clients cancelling ...sometimes for legit reasons ....but for that you have insurance and as you are the better financially equipped your mistake to skip insurance .....

My opinion would be if there is nothing in paperwork about cancellation policies then you should push to get your deposit back.

I understand what Odinsraven is saying with running costs to lodges etc, its still a few months out however and if you definitely going to reschedule for next year I don’t see the problem? Its as good as paying a deposit now for next year so why not just roll it over till then? I can understand losing part to cover lodge cost if there are any if not then just roll it over.

This is just my opinion.

What did your contract say? Did you buy trip insurance? Most any trip insurance would cover this. Most deposits are non refundable but at times may be rolled over to another date in the future. None of us know what the outfitter has gone through or what he has already paid to set up this safari. This makes it hard hard to judge the situation. Best of luck getting it rebooked and hope for a fast recovery from your surgery.

Hogpatrol said:

A friend was all set up to go with me for plains game in 2014. He had a back injury two weeks before departure and couldn't go. The outfitter offered to refund his deposit but was told to keep it for a future hunt. I hunted with the same outfitter this year and my friend's deposit is still good. Aside from that, he had purchased Travel Guard insurance and got back all of his prepaid expenses.

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Did Travelguard pay the daily fees deposit?

I think @Odinsraven makes an excellent point.

It all depends on the contract. If the contract says the deposit is lost, then we should really not be looking to "name and shame" the outfitter involved. Yes, many do roll over deposits, even if written contracts would allow them to keep it. But if the shoe was on the other foot, and the hunter was insisting that a term in the contract be adhered to, we would all support the hunter 100%.

I like to think I'm a man of my word, and if I sign a contract, I won't be critical of the other side for asking that I live up to it.

I just booked a hunt for the end of September. The (standard) contract said at this point I would lose my deposit if I cancelled (this is in Zimbabwe where quota has to be allocated). I asked if I could roll it over to next year if something came up, and got written confirmation that I could.

Hopefully your contract is either silent or gives you some flexibility. If not, then the lesson is (1) make sure you know what you sign, and if you see terms you think might be a bit tough, try to negotiate them. If the outfitter won't budge, then you can accept or look for another outfitter. Hunting is a very competitive business in Southern Africa. Second lesson is trip insurance.

Lastly, I hope the procedure is successful. Best of luck.

Philip Glass said:

Did Travelguard pay the daily fees deposit?

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Yes.

Britt Beck said:

I just read all the paperwork and there is nothing quoting anything regarding cancelation etc.

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According to the client the contract was silent. The outfitter at this point at least seems to have taken it upon himself...

Assuming this is correct, and assuming that rebooking a hunt a few months later was the intent then I don't think expecting the deposit to transfer is out of line at all. This wasn't a request for a refund, just a delay.

I know 2 hunters where Travel-guard paid airfare and deposits for medical cancellations (not just through the grapevine but guys I actually know), and 2 family members who collected.

You can put any amount you want, and if hunt gets closer and more funds are sent, increase coverage for an additional amount. But to get full coverage you must buy into the program in a certain time frame after deposit is made; IIRC I think its 10 days.


Frankly I see both sides of this; but the OP wants to roll date, not refund. And for a PG hunt in Limpopo?

Eh; there are just too many great outfits; I'd rather just cross this one off my list.

I hardly ever sign any contract; frankly the only outfit I would NOT recommend came with lots of small print. 2 ran well into 5 figures and we exchanged a few emails; but had the research well sussed out on them.

Royal27 said:

According to the client the contract was silent. The outfitter at this point at least seems to have taken it upon himself...

Assuming this is correct, and assuming that rebooking a hunt a few months later was the intent then I don't think expecting the deposit to transfer is out of line at all. This wasn't a request for a refund, just a delay.

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Exactly Royal. Not wanting to cancel. Just reschedule after doctors clearance.

Britt Beck said:

Exactly Royal. Not wanting to cancel. Just reschedule after doctors clearance.

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And this should not be that big a deal on just a plains game hunt. I could see him charging a small fee but to take the deposit and then think you would rebook is kind of crazy.

To me it come down to just doing the right thing contract or not.

billc said:

To me it come down to just doing the right thing contract or not.

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I'm with Bill here. And this, is why I think that this outfitter should be called out should this not get worked out. Call it "name and shame" if you'd like. I call it stating the facts.

If a man isn't going to be flexible, or especially if he's going to make up rules as he goes along (as the client has stated - yes I know there are always two sides) then I want to know about it, before I do business with him, not after.

I'm not asking an outfitter to break rules he doesn't want to. That's his right. It's my right however; not to do business with someone who refuses reasonable requests, even if the request isn't something he "has to do."

I wonder, would those who think the outfitter is within his right to keep the deposit feel the same way if the request was to move the hunt by one week and their was an open spot in the outfitter calendar? I mean the contracted dates wouldn't be net, so the deposit should be forfeit for the original date, right?

My first question was if there was any quota or permits involved for a reason. This would go right to the point of costing himself business or hurting his operation. If this was in Zim for a limited quota Leopard or Elephant, way different story. But for Limpopo plains game and with him wanted to reschedule due to medical reasons, it is a pretty tough stance to say send another deposit. Legally the outfitter might be in the right but what a horrible business practice.

Odinsraven said:

To be fair it is a double edged sword .......if you signed a contract ....you signed a contract ....

If you cant make it ...... lodges have a small season and costs to cover whether you arrive or not ..........

Some of the comments on here to be honest of the name and shame type are little more than cyber bullying .......

If the operation is small maybe they could not take the hit ......in my early 20's guided in the UK and Bulgaria ........ there are 2 sides and certainly I took a few financial hits that I should not have ....


However if the contract was signed and the terms stated so be it ......

I know and see a few outfitters who I hunt with taking hits from clients cancelling ...sometimes for legit reasons ....but for that you have insurance and as you are the better financially equipped your mistake to skip insurance .....

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Disagree.

You're in business? You aren't guaranteed success or profit. If you think you should never take a hit, you shouldn't be in any business and you aren't a smart or good businessman and should be working for someone who is. As far as "cyber bullying", that's your opinion of "naming and shaming". I call it full disclosure of a business's practices. I have ZERO qualms when it comes to naming unscrupulous or unethical business practices and neither should anyone else.

I think that is unacceptable as you wanted to move your hunt. If you booked your hunt through us we would have given you 50% of your deposit back if you let us know well in advance and if you moved the hunt to next year we would not have charged you a cent just the increase in prices if any.

I have limited experience as I just got back from my first safari. I was booked with pawprint and I asked him if we needed to sign any contracts and pieter said never have but we can if you want to. I trusted him so no need for one. But being active duty I was afraid I would get deployed etc. So I asked him about that (and this was after I sent him the deposit) he said well if that happens I'll see you when you get back. You lose nothing it will just roll over. This was on a booking that was booked almost 2 years in advance. Alot can happen in 2 years. Losing everything seems ridiculous even to a newbie like me that expected if something happened and I had to move dates I would lose my money.

They have finally responded and are working with me. I'm super stoked because I did want to hunt with these guys. They will make an exception to move it to this spring due to everything without any additional charge. So I'm happy with that. I appreciate everyone's input and advice.

Britt Beck said:

They have finally responded and are working with me. I'm super stoked because I did want to hunt with these guys. They will make an exception to move it to this spring due to everything without any additional charge. So I'm happy with that. I appreciate everyone's input and advice.

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That is awesome news!
Get that back fixed, start walking and shooting off sticks as soon as the doctors say so, and have a great trip.
Glad it worked out.

MAdcox said:

That is awesome news!
Get that back fixed, start walking and shooting off sticks as soon as the doctors say so, and have a great trip.
Glad it worked out.

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Thank you very much my friend.

Glad you got satisfaction. Maybe they were reading this thread?