Zimbabwe collared Elephant

How much money did Oxford get after Cecil? Millions?
John also noted that some “researchers” are trying to
Collar every Lion. With those new millions they may be able to pull it off.

How many “iconic” “significant” Bulls are there? Pretty small numbers really.
Is it really all that far fetched a goal for the “researchers” so inclined.
It would obviously be a significant cost , but with your donation you get to name your Elephant and save him from the big bad hunters!

BRICKBURN said:

How much money did Cambridge get after Cecil? Millions.
John also noted that some “researchers” are trying to
Collar every Lion. With those new millions they may be able to pull it off.

How many “iconic” “significant” Bulls are there? Pretty small numbers really.
Is it really all that far fetched a goal for the “researchers” so inclined.
It would obviously be a significant cost , but with your donation you get to name your Elephant and save him from the big bad hunters!

Click to expand...

Right on the money with that post.they will spend the money on the stupid stuff that does not help the animals. They want to save them from us the hunters. Need to take the blinders off to see who we are really fighting. Thses people don't care about facts or if we do things to help wildlife.

There is more then enough anti hunter and bunny huggers they would give millions towards something that would stop a hunter from taking an elephant.

BRICKBURN said:

How much money did Cambridge get after Cecil? Millions.
John also noted that some “researchers” are trying to
Collar every Lion. With those new millions they may be able to pull it off.

How many “iconic” “significant” Bulls are there? Pretty small numbers really.
Is it really all that far fetched a goal for the “researchers” so inclined.
It would obviously be a significant cost , but with your donation you get to name your Elephant and save him from the big bad hunters!

Click to expand...

LOTS of money. Almost none of which made it to Zim and the actual research if you believe what you read. So why haven't they already collared all of the lions? There are something over 2,000 lions in Hwange as I recall. Let's argue that 10% are six year and older makes, so 200. I wonder why everyone of those isn't yet collared? Should be relatively simple with all of that money....

I will again argue that the profit margin is better without saving the animals. Saving animals is expensive. If your costs go up 20% and donations only go up 10% it doesn't make sense to save them financially. It only makes sense to save them emotionally. And, although the vast majority of individual anti hunters are in it for the emotion (and want someone else to pay the big bucks to save the animals) the organizations are in it to profit from those emotional people.

If the anti org goal was truly to save the animals we'd be in much worse shape than we are already.

billc said:

The problem is sometimes you light the candle and people are still in the dark. I wish there was a way to kill them with kindness and we could all be happy. In the end the ones who want hunting stopped don't care how nice we are unless we say we will not kill another animal.

And John welcome to the site I know tim (tarbe ) is really looking forward to his hunt with you. I really hope all this bs does not ruin your lively hood and helping the wildlife like you do.

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Thank you for your kind words Bill - I really don't see any easy fix for this.
Best,
John

John Sharp said:

We never ever had problems like this before the advent of social media. This whole topic has now become rather grey...

Click to expand...

hi john welcome aboard ....didnt know you had snuck onto AH ...and yeah agree bout "social media"....cheers mike

Again 11,000 elephants are in the park, of which 20 were collared - .0018181 percent are by handshake are "off limits." Now only 18 are collared. Theses are iconic large tuskers, the ones you want the genes passed down the line.

Everyone complains about the anti's, when what we should be complaining are the about is shooting elephants that you know are going to get a big deal made out of the killing. I find the story less then convincing, when you have the same set of facts (alleged) for the second one that is taken shortly thereafter.

What happened to know your target, or perhaps they did?

wesheltonj said:

Again 11,000 elephants are in the park, of which 20 were collared - .0018181 percent are by handshake are "off limits." Now only 18 are collared. Theses are iconic large tuskers, the ones you want the genes passed down the line. ................

Click to expand...

It's not the stats on the total Elephant population that really matters.
How many "trophy" Elephants are there?
How many are collared? What's that percentage. Maybe it is 100% of them are collared.

Haven't the Oldest Elephants already been the prime breeding bull for how many years?
Perhaps 35 years since they were 15 years old.

I have no doubt the Photo Safari operators want all the Big Elephants they can have to WOW the customer. (I guess this is where the secret handshake must come in to play. )
Consumptive use certainly conflicts with that goal.

As hunter/conservationists we are charged with doing the best for the species we can. Usually that means taking only the oldest, post-breeding males. In the case of elephants, that should mean 50+ year old individuals on their last set of molars. Regardless of tusk size. I am wondering if it is research they are after, how many "matriarch" cows have been collared? Or is it just "significant" males? I have participated in rhino collaring, they did all sexes. Just wondering.

Looks like I was wrong, it's 22 and not 20 elephants that were collared.

https://fzs.org/en/news/joint-press-statement-gct/
Collared elephant bull shot adjacent to the Gonarezhou National Park


The Gonarezhou Conservation Trust (GCT), a partnership between the Zimbabwe Parks and Wildlife Management Authority (ZPWMA) and the Frankfurt Zoological Society (FZS), is saddened to announce the shooting of another one of its collared elephant bull by a professional hunter and his client in an area adjacent to the National Park on the afternoon of 11 April 2018.


Gonarezhou / Frankfurt, 17 April 2018

The GCT, on behalf of ZPWMA and FZS, is extremely disappointed by the loss of this collared elephant, particularly considering the ongoing efforts to engage with hunting operators outside of the Park’s boundaries. Incidents such as these threaten to undo much of the progress made and reinforce the need for stricter adherence to the ethical code of conduct for any hunting around the Park. It is a significant blow to conservation efforts in the greater ecosystem and can only serve to reinforce GCT’s commitment to protecting both these animals and their habitats.


As a result of the long-running and successful partnership between the ZPWMA and FZS, the elephant population within the National Park is very well protected. The Park itself has a globally significant and healthy elephant population estimated at over 11,000 individuals and at a density of 2 elephants/km² is one of the highest concentrations of elephants in Africa. Currently there are no fences that limit the movement of elephants or other wildlife out of the Gonarezhou National Park and they are free to wander into the wider ecosystem. In an effort to understand the dynamics of this population, and specifically their behaviour in the context of the wider ecosystem and the Great Limpopo Transfrontier Conservation Area (GLTFCA), a number of exercises were carried out to place satellite collars on a total of 22 individual elephants in the Park by GCT, the University of Zimbabwe and the Makoholi Research Institute. This would assist in highlighting the potential options for natural linkages within the GLTFCA ecosystem as well as to provide data that could be used in mitigating the conflict between humans and elephants outside of the park boundary.


On Thursday 12 April 2018 at 10h54, through a report made to the ZPWMA Officer in Charge at Mabalauta in the south of the National Park, GCT were alerted to the shooting of one of the Park’s collared elephant bulls in a hunt conducted by a professional hunter and his client outside the Gonarezhou in the Gonakudzingwa area. Whilst it is not illegal for a hunter to shoot a collared elephant, the general position taken by the Zimbabwe Professional Hunters and Guides Association (ZHPGA) is that it is unethical and should be avoided wherever possible. In his statement recorded after the hunt, the operator was well aware of the ethical stance and, as a result of previous similar incidences, was aware of the potential for collared individuals to roam into hunting areas outside of the Park. Thus, as a precautionary measure, GCT has taken to suspend the ranger assigned to monitor the hunt and, as per recommendation, has confiscated the ivory pending the outcome of an investigation.


In the wake of a similar incident on the 7 March 2018, GCT had intensified its efforts to monitor the movement of the collared elephants. Whilst the capability to observe the movement of these collared animals in real time does not currently exist, GCT is in the process of developing a monitoring system that can provide real time alerts of collared individuals leaving the boundary of the Gonarezhou National Park. It is thus particularly unfortunate that this capability was not available in time to potentially prevent this tragedy.

@Royal27 totally agree they aren't going to collar every elephant and the costs are ridiculous expensive. But I believe there is a significant fundraising opportunity for them with this. Cecil kind of lit the fire here. I feel it would be more cost effective and for research purposes to collar a younger bull or cow and track then for a long time, understand their movements and how their patterns changed as they got older? Just my thinking of research.

But I have kind of gone full circle in my thinking, if collar animals allow them to get publicity and fundraise, then we shouldn't shoot collar animals. But then that accomplishes their supposed end goal...but if we shoot one, and there is outrage, then there is more pressure to end imports and then there is less people hunting them.

It is a bit of "chicken or the egg" - and you did bring up another issue is if they collar all the big tuskers and the poachers figure out how to track them, they will all be gone in weeks.

It's a tough call but everytime we concede, ultimately we lose, especially when the other side is defining what is ethical for hunters.

Hunters shoot dead second collared bull elephant outside Zim park

https://www.news24.com/Africa/Zimba...lared-bull-elephant-outside-zim-park-20180421


Hunters shoot dead second collared bull elephant outside Zim park

Hunters in Zimbabwe have shot dead a bull elephant collared by scientists for research purposes, the second such killing in a month, a conservation group says.

The elephant was killed on April 12 by a hunter and his client in a hunting area just outside Gonarezhou National Park, where another collared bull elephant was shot in similar circumstances on March 7.

‘Significant blow’

A national parks ranger who was monitoring the hunt has been suspended and the elephant’s ivory confiscated pending the outcome of an investigation, said the Gonarezhou Conservation Trust (GCT).

It called the latest killing “a significant blow to conservation efforts”.

It is not illegal for a hunter to kill an animal with a collar, though it is deemed unethical.

“The (safari) operator was well aware of the ethical stance and, as a result of previous similar incidences, was aware of the potential for collared individuals to roam into hunting areas outside the park,” the trust said in a statement.

11 000 elephants

Zimbabwe’s main hunters’ association hasn’t yet commented on the incident. Zimbabwe's hunting industry was thrust into the spotlight in 2015 after a US hunter shot dead Cecil, a collared lion popular with tourists, after the animal strayed outside Hwange National Park.

GCT says it has collared more than 20 large bull elephants to monitor their movements and gather data for conservation purposes. Gonarezhou is said to have around 11 000 elephants, one of the highest concentrations in Africa.

It would seem that MP and I may be the only guides or PHs on this thread that have had clients take collared animals. In 28 years of guiding here in Colorado, I have had three hunters take collared sheep. It is perfectly legal in Colorado and I was told by the CPW that it actually aids them in researching how many sheep we may have if they analyze how many are killed with collars versus without collars based on how many they know they have collared. It is valuable to know! We cannot possibly count all our sheep in such rough and timbered country and Zim Parks cannot possibly count all the elephants or lions in the Zim bush. Zim Parks should appreciate the fact that once in a while a collared elephant gets killed. It provides REAL data as to wildlife movements and vulnerability to hunting. All this talk about not shooting collared animals is ridiculous and some of you are falling into this trap by thinking it may be unethical. It is a valuable piece of research to have to know the chances of a hunter taking a collared animal versus an uncollared animal! Collared animals should not be protected and this needs to be explained to the uneducated. A hunter draws a once-in-a-lifetime sheep tag or gets a chance at a once-in-a-lifetime large bull elephant and is told not to shoot - NO SIR.

In a addition, older elephants, just like older rams, get pushed out of the prime areas by younger rivals and when they wander out of the parks in Zim or Rocky Mountain National Park in Colorado, they are legal fair game. This opens a whole bunch of other problems with "parks" in the first place. I hate parks. Nonhunters go to parks and think it's nature. It's not! Animals with zero fear of man is unnatural. Period. Go to Serengeti and see the lions laying up against a tourist cruiser - does that seem natural to you? Parks just make anti-hunters think, "How could anyone hunt these nice and beautiful (tame) animals? Parks are a mess. We all like to visit a park once in a while but make no mistake, it's not a natural ecosystem. Man evolved with wildlife and hunting and therefore, parks are not natural and they go a long way to benefit anti-hunters and make us look bad as hunters. There is no reason that wildlife needs parks to be managed. Can you imagine if we only had wildlife in the USA in parks?