Are You This Hunter?

If I do make it to Africa, I promise not to show up with price tags hanging off my Abercrombie & Fitch clothing

rinehart0050 said:

Great thread @Hank2211

As others have said, I think you have much as you can to prepare for a hunt. But there are also limits to how much you can prepare.

When I hunted my lion, it was my first and I had never hunted lion before that. When I first has someone shoot at me in combat, I had never been shot at before.

There are limits to how much you can prepare. It's important to know your equipment, practice your battle drills, and be in shape. Beyond that, you've got to get out there and actually experience something to know how you'll really handle it.

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Rinehart is exactly correct. Nothing can make up for actual experience.

For those that do not have the luxury of regularly hunting with a guide, in my opinion, should consider booking guided hunts closer to home for the experience before charging off to a far away land with a new rifle and new gear.

Even those of us that are fortunate to hunt on a regular basis and "stay in practice", hunting with a guide, or PH, still has its own learning curve.

I will use my own hunting experience as an example, ( I don't know if it's good or bad, or will even help, but what the hell...)

I grew up hunting in Wa State. Mule deer, waterfowl, upland birds, hunted it all over the years with my father. Then I moved to Alaska, and oh boy, hunters paradise. Everything from rats at the dump to Brown Bear on Kodiak was on the menu. But... Never, ever, with a guide. Always DIY.

When I decided that I wanted to start "expanding my hunting horizons". I started looking at Africa, but I knew that I needed some experience hunting with outfitters/guides before I just booked and went on a hunt in Africa. First I managed to book a 1 day guided Florida hog hunt in conjunction with a family vacation. Shortly thereafter I hooked up with some buddies for a week long outfitted South Dakota pheasant hunt. Then a 1 day guided black Hawaiian ram hunt in Hawaii with another family vacation. Then a weekend turkey hunt with Gizmo at his place in Texas. All the while talking to everyone I could find about hunting in Africa, the outfitting business in general, and endless hours scouring AH.

Then last year took the leap and booked a PG hunt in South Africa with Paw Print, and had a blast!!! I am hooked on Africa!!

This was one of many trips to Africa to come in the next few years as long as I am healthy and the money gods provide.

"The result of all this blathering" (as velo dog might say) is that in my opinion, the more experience you can get your self, the better chance you will have of having a safe and fun hunting experience.

Cheers

Mekaniks said:

Rinehart is exactly correct. Nothing can make up for actual experience.

For those that do not have the luxury of regularly hunting with a guide, in my opinion, should consider booking guided hunts closer to home for the experience before charging off to a far away land with a new rifle and new gear.

Even those of us that are fortunate to hunt on a regular basis and "stay in practice", hunting with a guide, or PH, still has its own learning curve.

I will use my own hunting experience as an example, ( I don't know if it's good or bad, or will even help, but what the hell...)

I grew up hunting in Wa State. Mule deer, waterfowl, upland birds, hunted it all over the years with my father. Then I moved to Alaska, and oh boy, hunters paradise. Everything from rats at the dump to Brown Bear on Kodiak was on the menu. But... Never, ever, with a guide. Always DIY.

When I decided that I wanted to start "expanding my hunting horizons". I started looking at Africa, but I knew that I needed some experience hunting with outfitters/guides before I just booked and went on a hunt in Africa. First I managed to book a 1 day guided Florida hog hunt in conjunction with a family vacation. Shortly thereafter I hooked up with some buddies for a week long outfitted South Dakota pheasant hunt. Then a 1 day guided black Hawaiian ram hunt in Hawaii with another family vacation. Then a weekend turkey hunt with Gizmo at his place in Texas. All the while talking to everyone I could find about hunting in Africa, the outfitting business in general, and endless hours scouring AH.

Then last year took the leap and booked a PG hunt in South Africa with Paw Print, and had a blast!!! I am hooked on Africa!!

This was one of many trips to Africa to come in the next few years as long as I am healthy and the money gods provide.

"The result of all this blathering" (as velo dog might say) is that in my opinion, the more experience you can get your self, the better chance you will have of having a safe and fun hunting experience.

Cheers

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I wouldn't call it blathering, call it relating important experience.
I don't know if I'm "that hunter" or not. Maybe by some criteria I am. I grew up around guns, started shooting at 7 years old and have ever since. We always carried some kind of rifle everywhere. We hunted our way to school and back, target practiced whenever we chose, meat hunted in the fall.

I spent 30 years in Uncle Sam's service, carried (and taught) marksmanship on nearly every shoulder fired weapon system available. I've shot a lot of 3 gun and other competition. When I decided to book my safari, I really got serious and tuned up my small arms (308 win) and bought my 375HH. In the last couple months I have been on the range at least once a week shooting all kinds of drills with both rifles. I realize I have a ways to go even though I'm going for PG this time. I'm not about to tackle DG yet.

Africa is a whole nother ballgame and totally unfamiliar to me. I've hunted a lot in the US but that doesn't compare, I think, to what I am about to embark upon.Therefore, I am at the mercy of my PH and hope to hell I can be a good safe client. I want to live to return to Africa again and I don't want anyone's blood on my hands, except my own from thorns.

This is one of the best threads I've read to date. An awful lot to digest and a great way to self diagnose one's capabilities and shortcomings.

Hank2211 said:

Congratulations on your first hunt Sierraone!

I doubt you will find your PH endangering you or your son (great that you will be hunting together) but I think you will find that Africa takes a bit of a different perspective on firearms safety than we do in North America. And the "African" carry is only one example!

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I am aware there are differences, just soon will have to put theory into practice. Having watched videos off and on for many years now will help in achieving this practice.

@Hank2211 , great post. As a PH, that first shot a client takes on the shooting range tells me immediately what type of client I am going to be hunting with.....

Gun manners is vital to me, past clients will know that I am extremely strict on this, this is a part of the hunt a PH has total control, what animals do in the bush is the variable.

When I got hit by a buffalo, the two clients I was with were both brilliant and experienced hunters, the way the 3 buffalo acted was totally unpredicted. When I stood in front in of the buffalo I knew he was going to hit me, but I knew I had to protect my client, he was so close I had to put the end of my barrel behind the buffalo's head. We hunted another 7 buffalo on the safari.

A client doesn't need to be the best most experienced hunter, but should know how to handle his gun, the rest the PH can handle.

Before my first African hunt I had been shooting in competition with all kind of guns for nearly 40 years, which means shooting just about every week, and hunting for about 30 years, a few times with a guide.

In Africa, I just focused on safe gun handling and straight shooting, and for the rest, just followed my PH´s instructions. I did two PG hunts before attempting a DG hunt, I just felt I needed the field experience.

You'd have to ask my PH'S what kind of hunter I am. I do know that I was invited to stay, and did stay, in their personal homes after being with them on my hunts. I guess that says something.

Interesting thread for sure. For the average guy like myself in the field training would be impossible, I wish I could spend months in the bush alongside a professional PH. But as most folks here said all we can do is invest as much time as possible in shooting and physically and mentally preparing for a dangerous game hunt. Having both grizzly and brown bear hunts under my belt as well as a leopard hunt certainly makes me no expert but I can tell you when you see a griz or brownie for the first time and realize your not in a zoo it will make your hair on your arms stand up! I had my brown bear charge and by the grace of god I gave him a third eye, lucky damn right? Next year if god chooses I'll be back for leopard or Cape buffalo, I'll be ready one way or another.

When we decided to go to Africa I did not have much big game experience. In fact, one of the reasons for going was to get experience and learn. So, to answer the OP, in my mind this took any kind of dangerous game off the table. I did not think it was safe to go dangerous game hunting without a decent amount of big game experience. But, I also felt I would not appreciate the experience in the same way unless I had other big game under my belt first.

I did believe that meticulous gun manners, being able to shoot straight, and being in decent shape, made it entirely reasonable to go PG hunting.

I think if you leave Africa and start checking on how to become a PH in Africa, you might pass the first test. I agree to who said if you are on this site and are constantly trying to learn more about what to expect in the field is typical of good hunting practices. As for kids shooting lions and elephants before taking down a chipmunk with the accuracy of Wyatt Earp with a red rider lever action, how does that fever for hunting ever grow.

johnnyblues said:

Interesting thread for sure. For the average guy like myself in the field training would be impossible, I wish I could spend months in the bush alongside a professional PH. But as most folks here said all we can do is invest as much time as possible in shooting and physically and mentally preparing for a dangerous game hunt. Having both grizzly and brown bear hunts under my belt as well as a leopard hunt certainly makes me no expert but I can tell you when you see a griz or brownie for the first time and realize your not in a zoo it will make your hair on your arms stand up! I had my brown bear charge and by the grace of god I gave him a third eye, lucky damn right? Next year if god chooses I'll be back for leopard or Cape buffalo, I'll be ready one way or another.

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If I weren't so damn old, I would give an outfitter and PH a few weeks just to learn and not fire a shot unless it turned out to be necessary. Would just need food and a bed!!! But alas, maybe in the next life!

Hank2211 said:

..........

On a recent hunt to South Africa, I wore a new pair os shorts and deliberately kept the $29.95 Cabelas tag on it, to annoy my cameraman who had made some comment on prior hunts about "nice clothes." As well, I have brought brand new rifles to Africa (they all start somewhere!), but I like to think I'm a good sport about the ribbing I get for having expensive rifles (I save on shorts)!
.......

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I think the stereotype heads more toward the fella that has never really shot that brand new rifle and shows up with it, not the guys who buy the new ones, work them up and then take them hunting.

I like the price tag idea. Well worth the laughs.

PeteG said:

Very interesting thread here.
This brings back a thought from a thread recently about whether a hunter should hunt DG on his first hunt over to Africa.
I am not picking on that thread specifically, but a number of people here suggested he might as well do it, perhaps this brings something additional to think about.
Perhaps hunting DG should be something that is built up to, there are a lot more responsibilities on the hunters shoulders, whether they know it or not, when hunting DG.
An injured Zebra for instance, due to the shakes or buck fever, is not a threat to the hunter, ph, trackers and others in the area. whereas an injured buffalo or ele could potentially be a torrid surprise for the next client and ph.
Ive seen some people shake so badly that there was no way they could hit the target.

So as a question to ph's, what do you do if your client is not ready for the expensive hunt for lion/ele that he has just paid big money for yet he could be a danger to you and your team?

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I think you are referring to my thread. I just logged on to the computer after spending about 20 minutes on the phone with my PH discussing this topic among others. This thread was my first stop on the forum after signing on. I hope I won't be "that hunter" and I explained my concerns to the PH some time back. He seems okay with my lack of dangerous game experience although it still greatly concerns me. I won't be going until 2018 but as soon as I made up my mind that I would hunt dangerous game at some point I bought a .375 H&H and have been practicing with it and will continue to do so until my departure for Africa whether I decide to do the dangerous game or not. I try to be ready for whatever hunt I decide to undertake and nothing will change with this hunt other than more shooting to get familiar with my rifle. Apart from load development, I shoot from field positions exclusively with the emphasis on sticks out to 200 yards and close range (25-50 yards) offhand, firing as rapidly as I can work the bolt and reacquire the target. I'm getting better and with the pile of bullets I got when Midway was selling the blems I'll be able to practice regularly until departure. Hopefully I'll be ready when the time comes.

Great thread!

Well I hope I'm not that hunter. I would say overall I'm an average hunter. I go alot and and I am determined and think that the fact I just won't give up contributes to my success. I wish I could say it was talent, a 6th sense or something else, but I go and go and I learn an area and an animal.

I practice alot with the big bore before a dangerous game hunt both at the range and I dry fire dummy rounds for a half hour to an hour each night to get the muscle memory and speed and just use to the feel. Both of my dangerous game hunts have not gone exactly in a text book manner (ironically my Rhino dart did). I would love to have had clear shot at my lion, I would love to of had a 20 yard side brain shot on my elephant. Neither worked out that way as both my lioness and elephant presented difficult shots. You practice for not everything goes right but for when things don't go exactly as planned.

But I have left my ego at the door, I have told my PHs that once the animal (dangerous game only) is hit feel free to shoot, I don't want to put anyone in danger due to my own ego. I know some may frown at the this stance, but I owe it to everyone involved and the animal to get it down as quickly as possible.

I love the comments. I think as long as you are asking the question, you are "not that hunter". I start every guided hunt asking the P.H./ Guide "what is the top 5 things you wish clients wouldn't do?" And then pay attention to the response. No one has yet mentioned the SAAMI courses available for DG training. Should look into that. I personally feel for most people plains game should be first just for a feel of how things work, etc before tackling DG. And practice, practice, practice. I have never shown up on a hunt with equipment I haven't tried out. I don't need equipment failures unnecessarily. I havehad some, but not from new or don't fit, etc.

The Valley is "Real" Africa. It's deepest darkest Africa. It's as big as a large US State. It's 6 hours drive to the first human being with a radio other than maybe 2-3 other camps that *may* be occupied. There are no fences. 6 of the dangerous 7 are in good numbers in that location. (all 6 of them came into my camp) Poachers run sorties from Zambia with regularity. Injured animals from poachers are all over those areas from Mana pools, Nyakasanga, Chewore, and Sapi. It's the kind of place, just like Alaska or just like a lower-48 sheep hunt where it takes two mistakes. Usually on a hunt, you have to make 3-4 back to back mistakes to get killed. In the Valley, two is a enough to get you killed.

An idiot casting from the shore of camp could get killed very easily by a croc if not remaining perpetually vigilant to what surrounds him. A hippo hunt could go quite wrong so you better be confident you can turn one with a flawlessly operating double rifle or magazine rifle that is proven under pressure. You better have the disposition to not drink to the level of stupidity because a stroll 40' out of camp could get you killed as they are in the process of making a few maneaters presently. (old unhunted male lions with emaciated skeletons were seen in July...they WILL try to kill you at camp if they get desperate enough and you're stupid). Charlie the pet elephant comes through camp nightly but he hates $@^@%#$ tourists that shine lights at him or approach...you'll get stomped if you do what dumb people do to elephants. He also likes to breath on you through the tent screen some nights and surely a dumbass making a shriek or losing his nerve will result in potential loss of life due to stupidity. Plenty of ways for stupid rich people to get killed in the valley for certain!

I definitely agree having been there, done that, that it is a place that ought not to be bought by ill prepared thrill seekers. You'll note the meticulous care I take in the weapons I choose to use, how I prepare for trips, the risk management I take at every step of the road and most importantly, WHO I select as a PH to guide my trips. I'm in no way in good shape but I was able to push myself 27km tracking a dugga boy, was able to walk myself 7km out of the bush, and was able to ultimately make my shot 2 hours later in a state of sheer exhaustion. If you cannot push yourself and your limits and if you cannot walk silently for 34km, you might not want to hunt DG in the valley. Game is scarce as in it must be worked for much harder than a high fence RSA option. Medical care is laughably distant. It's not for everyone and should be given a level of reverence unique to Zim dangerous game areas. You also should not go there if you have medical conditions as getting someone out of the Valley is a major ordeal (15 hours to Harare by safari cruiser).

Long story cut brief: clients get PHs killed. If you don't know what you're doing please go to RSA and tell your PH you don't know what you're doing. Don't go to a DG wilderness hunt in the Valley if you're not reasonably prepared.

I think you convinced me!

precise info,the real deal.

I certainly applaud the physical preparation described by the previous posts, but I think this question is more mental than physical. If you go over with physical limitations, the PH can adapt for them. But if you are an a$$hole who thinks they know everything about everything ... what is the PH to do?

@Scott Slough , it only takes a PH one day to sort the a$$hole out, he will be in bed early and his feet and body will hurt like hell....