375 H&H vs 416 Rem vs 416 Rigby

I agree for lion and plains game, 375 H&H. A 416 Rigby is the next logical step up for distance and power. The .416 Rem and .416 Ruger are versatile calibers too.

Plenty of good advice here. If you're not a hand loader and therefore buy factory ammo, you may want to take a look at the ammo that is most available in the big bores and the cost. I think you'll find the .416 Rigby to be a bit shocking.

Good point Phil, the 416 Rigby is a bit more expensive to buy factory ammo!

PHOENIX PHIL said:

Plenty of good advice here. If you're not a hand loader and therefore buy factory ammo, you may want to take a look at the ammo that is most available in the big bores and the cost. I think you'll find the .416 Rigby to be a bit shocking.

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I agree Phil - ammo for the Rigby is very expensive. Having said that, this isn't a gun you'll typically be putting hundreds of rounds through. So the reality is that you don't need that much ammo, and the cost - while it hurts when you buy - tends not to be a huge factor in the overall cost of ownership.

Hank2211 said:

I agree Phil - ammo for the Rigby is very expensive. Having said that, this isn't a gun you'll typically be putting hundreds of rounds through. So the reality is that you don't need that much ammo, and the cost - while it hurts when you buy - tends not to be a huge factor in the overall cost of ownership.

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Yes that's true but you owe yourself and your PH to practice. That can add up in a hurry and if you curb the practice to save $$, it might cost you a lot more.

I agree you need to practice, but do you always need to practice on the rifle you're going to shoot? Can you imagine practicing on a .577 Tyrannosaur?!

Don't get me wrong - you need to have put a reasonable number of rounds through any rifle to know how it shoots, and, more important, how you shoot with it. But when I take mine to the range, I always take a .223 (a nice Ruger) and I put way more shots through the .223 than I do the .416. I get to focus on things like my trigger pull, or my shot placement, without having to think about controlling the bigger gun. When I go home, I feel like I've had a pretty good day of practice, even though I've never taken the .223 hunting. Do you think I'm doing this wrong? I hope not!

I'm sure there are different views on this - but that's mine.

I would have to agree to a point with you Hank, I practice with my Ruger M77 .223 a lot more than than the expensive calibers to shoot. You still have to handle recoil.

Hank2211 said:

I agree you need to practice, but do you always need to practice on the rifle you're going to shoot? Can you imagine practicing on a .577 Tyrannosaur?!

Don't get me wrong - you need to have put a reasonable number of rounds through any rifle to know how it shoots, and, more important, how you shoot with it. But when I take mine to the range, I always take a .223 (a nice Ruger) and I put way more shots through the .223 than I do the .416. I get to focus on things like my trigger pull, or my shot placement, without having to think about controlling the bigger gun. When I go home, I feel like I've had a pretty good day of practice, even though I've never taken the .223 hunting. Do you think I'm doing this wrong? I hope not!

I'm sure there are different views on this - but that's mine.

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So long as a reasonable number of rounds is sufficient to break in a new to big bore shooter to the recoil and the shooter can shoot accurately and quickly, it's all good.

I also think it wise that a new rifle has plenty, say maybe 100 rounds through it to ensure any bugs in the rifle are revealed.

Gentlemen thank you for your advice, Ive read each of these replies. I live in the Carolinas and love to hunt. I'm leaning heavily now to the 375 simply because of the advice here and because I really have no desire to hunt elephants or hippo. I want 3 cats, male lion, lioness and leopard. Next it would be a dream to get a coastal brown in Alaska. I figure most of the coastal browns are easily taken with a .338 so the 375 will be more than enough.

I've looked at 416s and they are indeed pricey right now I'm 75% 375 25% 416. Thank you all for the advice Ill be reading more through out this site.

Again thank you.

I was facing a similar decision, when I started out I was simply going to hunt plains game and I already have a 9,3x62 so I was all set. Once I started serious planning, the Cape Buffalo reared his ugly head and soon after I decided I may as well add Leopard to the deal. I got a .375 H&H, I can't deny that nostalgia played a part in my decision as it had also done with the 9,3x62. I figured the Leopard would be a one time thing and I would be only shoot more than one Buffalo if very lucky so the .375 was a no brainer for me.

enysse said:

I would have to agree to a point with you Hank, I practice with my Ruger M77 .223 a lot more than than the expensive calibers to shoot. You still have to handle recoil.

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I have solved this problem with hand loads, I have reduced loads for practice and they allow me to shoot many more rounds per session while concentrating on the basics. I always try to shoot a few full power loads during each session just to get used to the recoil, this way I am using the same rifle so everything is exactly the same except recoil. I have about 100 rounds down range so far with probably 95% of them fired off sticks or offhand.

Another thought I have, if you have no problem buying a used rifle you could look at a Whitworth Express, I found one in very good condition for just a bit over $800.00, they show up for sale on a pretty regular basis on gunbroker.

Good luck with your decision and your safari!

BobT, do you use two different scopes for practice or do just adjust the scope to a new point of aim?
I think that is another great option too BTW.

Hi guys.
My sugestion 9,3 x 62 and 404Jeffery.
Witold

One more for the .375, and a SAKO would be a good choice.

Lion and plains game. hmmmmmmmmmmm. Sounds like you need a .30-06 Springfield. If you still have that rifle in .325 WSM, you should be fine. However, if it were me and would want to go after lion, I would ask the PH of the concession you are hunting with. I will also bet that they will tell you that a 9.3 x 62 would be plenty too!

enysse said:

BobT, do you use two different scopes for practice or do just adjust the scope to a new point of aim?
I think that is another great option too BTW.

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I have been doing all my practicing with the express sights so far, the lighter loads are a little off from the full power stuff but close enough. I have ordered a scope (2.5-8 VX3i) from the Leupold custom shop but it hasn't arrived yet.

I suggest taking a long hard look at the Sako Kodiak 375. Under 2K, Awesome accuracy, tons of features including great sights... A GREAT package...
Contact me direct direct if you want....

If you are taking two rifles; going on John "Pondoro" Taylor's recommendation, I'd go .416. I have a .375 H&H and I don't have doubt that it would do the job handily. Taylor says that the .416 would with 410 grain soft points would crumple a charging lion like no other. I am going to defer to his judgement, as he shot more game than probably most PH's do in their lifetime. I would go .416 Rigby because I am a traditionalist and get some 410 grain Woodleigh softs. You don't need to push them to max. I would say 2,300 would make quite a dent in a lion's pride (pun intedended.) ... I'm hilarious. Anyway. That would be my recommendation for soley lion.... bring your .325 for plains game.

However, If you wanted to take just one rifle... .375! It's still the king. I personally would bring one load. 270 grain TSX would be my recommendation, but any 270+ premium would do just fine at about 2700fps. The major plus to the .375 is that if anything happens to your ammo, odds are that your PH will probably have rounds that would do the job in camp. It's also a great plains game cartridge from what I hear. It certainly topples black bear and whitetail deer with authority!

For a .416 Rigby Rifle, I would look into American Hunting Rifles ---> http://americanhuntingrifles.com/. Buy a CZ 550 and have them do the work on it. From what I hear, they are great.

For a .375 H&H, $1,500 gets you a brand new CRF Winchester Model 70. It really needs nothing right out of the box. I don't shoot mine for groups so if it does 1.5" at 100 yards it's good enough for me. If you are concerned about getting .5 MOA out of your big game rifle, I cannot speak to that as I personally don't concern myself with it. I will say that the Winchester is plenty accurate, has sleek beautiful lines and comes out of the box ready for the hunt!

At the end though... I have never hunted dangerous game with my .375. I am planning a trip for 2020, so take my opinion for what it is worth. Best of luck!

Lion and PG = .375

I wouldn't worry about the .416 until you are ready to tackle buff. My 416 of choice is the Rem mag for a couple reasons:

1) The excellent and affordable M70 is chambered for this cartridge. Unlike my CZs, my M70s are good to go out of the box.

2) Brass is affordable and easily obtained, and you save $$ on powder compared to the Rigby. It is a super easy big-bore to load for.

3) 416 rem factory ammo is very prolific. Gun stores from Alaska to Africa stock it. I have never seen 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger ammo in any gun store.

Guys THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!!! I've decided I'm going with....drum roll......................................................

416 Rem Mag.

Here's why, I said before I have no interest in hunting elephant. But I do and will have Buffalo on my bucket list. I'm only 43 years old and I'm quite certain I'll be staring down black death at some point. I also may want to hunt some problem hippos in the future. My hunt next year is for a lioness so I'll certainly be back for a male lion at some point also. Who knows by then I may have the elephant itch. The cost of the ammo won't be a problem. I'll shoot the gun but like someone said I'll practice off sticks with something else. Ammo cost won't be that much of a big deal. I know the 375 is capable for all but if Im going to shoot a lion or buffalo I want to drop a hammer on them.

I've narrowed it down to a CZ 416, Kimber Caprivi or I may be getting a SWEET deal on a Cooper 416 without all the crazy fancy options but its still a beauty with a great price.

As for the 375 again on my dream list is coastal brown bear in Alaska and crocodile so I'll have 2 good excuses for my wife as to why I'll have to purchase a 375 later down the road. I've personally had someone tell me they shot at a crocodile laying prone with a 416 they wished they had used a 375. The 416 laying down, the recoil was brutal.

Again guys thanks for all the replies, when I get her and get her scoped I'll post some pictures!

Obi Wan Kenobi said:

Guys THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!!! I've decided I'm going with....drum roll......................................................

416 Rem Mag.

Here's why, I said before I have no interest in hunting elephant. But I do and will have Buffalo on my bucket list. I'm only 43 years old and I'm quite certain I'll be staring down black death at some point. I also may want to hunt some problem hippos in the future. My hunt next year is for a lioness so I'll certainly be back for a male lion at some point also. Who knows by then I may have the elephant itch. The cost of the ammo won't be a problem. I'll shoot the gun but like someone said I'll practice off sticks with something else. Ammo cost won't be that much of a big deal. I know the 375 is capable for all but if Im going to shoot a lion or buffalo I want to drop a hammer on them.

I've narrowed it down to a CZ 416, Kimber Caprivi or I may be getting a SWEET deal on a Cooper 416 without all the crazy fancy options but its still a beauty with a great price.

As for the 375 again on my dream list is coastal brown bear in Alaska and crocodile so I'll have 2 good excuses for my wife as to why I'll have to purchase a 375 later down the road. I've personally had someone tell me they shot at a crocodile laying prone with a 416 they wished they had used a 375. The 416 laying down, the recoil was brutal.

Again guys thanks for all the replies, when I get her and get her scoped I'll post some pictures!

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do CZ make a 416 Rem ?

Check out the Win Mod 70 in 416 Rem , fantastic rifle , well balanced and great value for money.