New USA requirements in addition to the form 4457

This new regulation has taken just about everyone by surprise.

That I know of in this thread the NRA has been notified about it. Along with quite a few other organizations. The best thing that you can do is to contact your Congressional Representative in Washington and let him know also.

If you don't know who your Representative is here is a link that will help you out.
http://www.house.gov/representatives/find/

Philip Glass said:

We have to stop Government agencies from writing law!

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Throughout our society in the US. Not just gun laws... This is running amuck. The burocrats are so entrenched they really run things. Even when Congress passes a law.. It is subject to interpretation by the burocrats implementing it. Often resulting in something different than intended.

Philip Glass said:

I would like to know if anyone here knows what the NRA is doing about this?

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I contact the NRA-ILA (and if you are a member you should too!) I also contacted my representative, and the ICE policy office for a clarification. But I have not heard anything from anyone yet. This is starting to become my windmill to joust!

From what I can tell, this all was published on Monday with no warning. This is the type of thing that happens when the executive branch abuses its power, a judicial branch is biased, and a congress that is corrupt/impotent. This won't be the first nor the last of this type of thing. We just have to keep pushing back.

robertq said:

Action Bob,
What they don't tell you is you have to be approved to get the number.....

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Robert,

Firstly, thank you for all of your insights and information. Secondly, do you have any idea what we're supposed to do when we arrive at the airport? I am used to just going to the airline and checking in. The way this information reads, it appears that we need to go to a CBP officer before we check in. I'm not even sure where I find them at the Orlando airport.

Thanks,

John

thi9elsp said:

Robert,

Firstly, thank you for all of your insights and information. Secondly, do you have any idea what we're supposed to do when we arrive at the airport? I am used to just going to the airline and checking in. The way this information reads, it appears that we need to go to a CBP officer before we check in. I'm not even sure where I find them at the Orlando airport.

Thanks,

John

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I plan on calling the Customs office in Denver International and ask them what they want me to do the day before my flight leaves. That way if I need to I can plan extra time to jump through their hoops. They can also tell you where they are located at in the terminal.

Makes sense, thanks.

Just a thinking.....
From the USA to Canada is out of the country.......

Yup, I thought of that too. Have always wanted to whitetail up there. I bet alot of guys that go up there every fall have no clue about this yet.

Just sent a note to Lou Dobbs Tonight. Maybe we can get the media to jump on this too and show the idiocy of the regulation. We'll see if they even read or respond to me.

thi9elsp said:

Just sent a note to Lou Dobbs Tonight. Maybe we can get the media to jump on this too and show the idiocy of the regulation. We'll see if they even read or respond to me.

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I am hoping someone takes this on. Right now it just people in Internet forums like this one discussing it. The problem is that only a small set of people go overseas to hunt. So far it seems hard to get other gun owners fired up about this.

brushmore said:

I am hoping someone takes this on. Right now it just people in Internet forums like this one discussing it. The problem is that only a small set of people go overseas to hunt. So far it seems hard to get other gun owners fired up about this.

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I agree. I posted this on a couple of other outdoor forums and have yet to receive a reply on any of the post. I also haven't heard back from my Congressman yet either after 3 days. He may be looking into it but a simple replay that he is looking at it would be nice.

Right now there are too many ostriches with their heads stuck in the sand thinking that if they ignore the problem that it will go away or that it doesn't affect them so why worry about it. But I will wager that come this fall when hunting seasons start up in Canada and the US sportsmen start to head up there then you will hear a lot more about it.

Right now those of us headed to Africa or the few that are headed to South America are the only ones that it affects, and we wouldn't even know about it if ActionBob hadn't mentioned it.

So I sent via their respective websites a message to both Senator McCain and my congressional rep Matt Salmon a couple days ago. I had not heard back from them as of this morning. So I called the local office of Representative Salmon and spoke to someone who I found quite sympathetic to the situation. Rep Salmon's website actually has a link for "Help with a Federal Agency" tab where you can fill in your personal information and send that back to the office. He had me do that and said he'll be on it, I guess we'll see. But like I said after explaining the situation, he understood the lunacy of what's going on, so I'm hopeful.

As I see it there are really two different issues here. The first is the continuing intrusion of the government on our 2A rights. This latest intrusion is something that I don't think is going to be resolved quickly, certainly not in time for those with hunting trips to Africa or elsewhere in the next couple of months.

The second issue is that we will have to, albeit begrudgingly so, comply with the regulations if we wish to travel abroad with our firearms for at least the near term. SSI has done us a service to help us out with getting the right paperwork in place, thank you again Robert.

What still concerns me is the following:

Before exporting any firearms and/or ammunition with a valid DDTC or BIS export license or a qualifying license exemption, the traveler, or an agent acting on the traveler’s behalf, must file the Electronic Export Information (EEI) using the Automated Export System (AES) or the Internet-based system AESDirectwhich is publicly availableand free of charge. In addition to filing the EEI in AES orAESDirect prior to export, all firearms, ammunition and additional mandatory documentation (e.g., certifications, foreign import permits, proof of AES filing; such as the Internal Transaction Number) must be presented to U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) authorities for visual inspection at the port of departure from the United States.

This is quite easy for me if Phoenix is my port of departure. There is a CBP office 10 minutes from my work. But what if my port of departure from the US is Atlanta?

The process is still very much FUBAR and I urge you all to also contact your congressional rep. The more we raise this issue to them and let them know how many people it's affecting the more likely something gets done and the less likely you'll have trouble.

I know from another forum that @Frostbit is in the middle of this as he is leaving quite shortly for his and Joyce's next safari. And he has also got some help from his representative. @Frostbit, could you also chime in on this thread?

Next update. As mentioned @Frostbit contacted his representative, which I now know is Rep. Don Young, who is in Alaska. I passed this information on to Rep. Salmon's office. The gent there is going to check with Rep Young's office shortly. He also told me he has a letter from Rep. Salmon in progress to go out shortly.

So again, I encourage you to contact your representatives and also mention the names for the two representatives along. The more momentum we can get, the better.

Just sent emails to Bill Nelson, Marco Rubio and Richard Nugent all from Florida. We'll see what kind of response I get.

I have contacted my rep as well. I'm not very optimistic any of these douchenozzle politicians will help any though. All they care about is riding the gravy train and getting re-elected. Pisses me off to no end what these freeloaders get away with. Worth a try though.

JGRaider said:

I have contacted my rep as well. I'm not very optimistic any of these douchenozzle politicians will help any though. All they care about is riding the gravy train and getting re-elected. Pisses me off to no end what these freeloaders get away with. Worth a try though.

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thi9elsp said:

Just sent emails to Bill Nelson, Marco Rubio and Richard Nugent all from Florida. We'll see what kind of response I get.

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I think you should forget about emails gents, they'll just be one more in the stack. Be a bigger but polite PITA to them and call. You may not be successful, but unless I'm getting smoke blown up my rear end which is entirely possible, calling seems to have been more effective than the emails I sent.

I just spoke to Jeff at SCI Governmental Affairs in Washington DC: (202)543-8733.

Supposedly this has been a law since 2012 but that Customs is just now going to start to enforce it. SCI is drafting materials through the weekend to get something around ruling on this (not sure exactly what as he couldn't tell me much). They should be communicating out to membership early next week.

Doesn't make me feel much better but at least one of the organizations is doing something about.

Phil - I'm sure you are right on the email vs. call. Just trying to fit in what I can while getting some work done so I can pay for my trip!

thi9elsp said:

Supposedly this has been a law since 2012 but that Customs is just now going to start to enforce it.

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That confirms what I found researching this but I figured I had to be wrong. I figured how could this be on the books and no one noticed or cared? All this is published by the GPO on the web so it's not some secret. Kind of makes you wonder what else is out there is not enforce yet.

PHOENIX PHIL said:

@Frostbit, could you also chime in on this thread?

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Guys, I leave in four days. I'd love to chat but I really don't have time. Here's a cut and paste from another forum, where I spend far too much time already.

OK folks I'm a bit worn out but here's your update and fix.

You need an ITN Number to depart and return. Initially the Customs and Border Protections folks were friendly and clueless about this procedure. I awoke the Dragon though and got calls from three Offices today Anchorage, Seattle and Houston. They are now aware of the problem and didn't have a solution until 1300 today.

I was called by the Chief Customs Officer in Anchorage politely asking me to return to the Port with my firearms, 4457's, passport, and itinerary.

They inputted the data into their C&BP system and gave me my ITN Number right then. That's the number you need. Here's the potential problem. They gave me that number hand written on a yellow sticky note. They had no capacity to print it on official letterhead.

That number is needed in three places now. You may need to produce it at departure for C&BP officer (or you may not). It depends on whether the ticking agent is up to speed on this.

You will need to produce it for TSA when you drop off your gun case. Problem is TSA does not have any means to verify the veracity of the number and as I stated mine is on a yellow sticky.

Lastly, you will definitely need that ITN number for C&BP on your return.

My understanding from speaking with Steve Turner is he can help you get the number as well but you will need an IEN from the IRS for that to occur. My understanding is that you have to declare yourself as a sole Proprietor to get it because the IRS system does not have capacity for individuals to get the number.

Since I had no clue how long that would take I opted to go with the C&BP option.

Lastly I asked them about the poor sucker that lives in small town USA without a C&BP office. The answer was unsavory.

You have to obtain this ITN no less than 8 hours before your departure. If you use the C&BP route as I did you have to go in person with the times I outlined above. The suggestion was an itinerary with an over night before international departure to allow greater than 8 hours to get your ITN or a separate trip sometime before your actual trip.

The Chief was sympathetic, helpful, and genuinely appreciative for my help in bringing this matter to light.

I love Alaska!!

On a side note, Representative Don Youngs office has been briefed by me and called me multiple times and had me document this fiasco in text for them. The Deputy Director was not very pleased with the inter-agency runaround she has received and vowed to press the issue and affect some change.

I recommend the rest of you press your Representatives and Senators to also press for change.


Cheers
Jim

thi9elsp said:

I just spoke to Jeff at SCI Governmental Affairs in Washington DC: (202)543-8733.

Supposedly this has been a law since 2012 but that Customs is just now going to start to enforce it. SCI is drafting materials through the weekend to get something around ruling on this (not sure exactly what as he couldn't tell me much). They should be communicating out to membership early next week.

Doesn't make me feel much better but at least one of the organizations is doing something about.

Phil - I'm sure you are right on the email vs. call. Just trying to fit in what I can while getting some work done so I can pay for my trip!

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The Executive action that gave this teeth was signed March 8th 2013 http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/DCPD-201300143/pdf/DCPD-201300143.pdf