Winchester M70 Safari vs Sako Brown Bear in 416

[TOBY458]

Interesting, are they ejected straight up? It'd be pretty hard to set up a 40 cal rifle so that you can comfortably use high mounted scope and irons.

I have a Sako Kodiak in 375 H&H and a Sako Grey Wolf in 9.3x62 that both work well with the Low optilok rings. They are a bit higher than most low rings by nature though. If you do have a problem with it hitting the scope, you can turn the scope 45° so the windage turret is now your elevation turret and your elevation turret is now your windage turret on the left side of the scope. This will clear the ejection port completely and you shouldn't have an issue at all. But if you do that, obviously you would need a standard duplex scope with only 2 turrets.
As to the 85 being control round feed or not, it is kind of a hybrid action. It is crf in a way, but it doesn't grap the cartridge quite as soon as a mauser style bolt does. My rifle is very reliable, so I wouldn't give that a second thought.
I also have a Winchester 70 416 Remington mag. It is an excellent rifle. Feeds and functions flawlessly. And, it's one of the most accurate rifles I own in any caliber.
I like the 416 Remington mag and if you're a hand loader, it's much less expensive to feed. Pressure is not a problem if you keep your loads in the 2300-2350 fps range with a 400 Grain bullet. It also burns about 25 less grains of powder to accomplish the same ballistics as the Rigby, which leads to less recoil.
But, since I'm a lover of Sako rifles, it would be hard for me not to hit the Sako Brown Bear button.

 

[BenKK]

I had a scoped Sako Kodiak .375H&H, no ejection issues at all - think I was using medium Optiloks.

I don’t know if there would be a problem scoping my Sako Brown Bear .500J, but it seems to eject empties out to my right and back a bit.

I saw a recent hunting movie where a client had what looked to be a scoped Sako Brown Bear in .375H&H (on a Buchanan Hunts video on YouTube), and no issues for him, either.

 

[Jeff 907]

Both are excellent no doubt and I don’t think you could go wrong with either. For me Sako shoulders and tracks better than the Winchester. I do wish both had a longer LOP.

 

[Dr Ray]

I agree with the earlier post that both are excellent rifles. IMHO when you are talking 416 Caliber you are talking about the possibility of hunting DG. With that in mind I'd take the Winchester because it is a CRF over the Sako which is not.

Sako is a sort of controlled feed but definitely not a full controlled feed.

 

[Shootist43]

Doc, isn't that something like "is she pregnant or isn't she?"

 

[wesheltonj]

SAKO

 

[Opposite Pole]

How about the quality of the sights on these rifles? Are they fine out of the factory or is there a need for aftermarket ones?

 

[BenKK]

How about the quality of the sights on these rifles? Are they fine out of the factory or is there a need for aftermarket ones?

The Sako front bead is way too big! Only good to fifty metres on buffalo, even that might be stretching it. I expect to be able to make good chest shots on buffalo out to 100m on buffalo. So both my Sakos got a finer bead fitted and then I was very happy!

 

[TOBY458]

How about the quality of the sights on these rifles? Are they fine out of the factory or is there a need for aftermarket ones?

Winchester has a sight similar to NECG. All steel adjustable.
The Sako has a V notch with white outline rear, and large white bead front.
I prefer the sako sights.

 

[steve white]

Sako bolt is tricky to disassemble--no way anyone in the boonies could help you if it needed help. Then again, they never seem to have issues. Go with the one that fits you or else make it fit!

 

[TOBY458]

Sako bolt is tricky to disassemble--no way anyone in the boonies could help you if it needed help. Then again, they never seem to have issues. Go with the one that fits you or else make it fit!

The Sako 85 bolt is simple to disassemble. Just twist the bolt shroud clockwise 45° and it comes right off. Then the spring and firing pin can be removed with ease.

 

[Dr Ray]

Not anymore Sir!

Just finished a DG safari in Zim with a Sako 85 Safari in .416 Rigby. Gun worked perfectly through the hunt. It happens to like 450 grain Woodleigh FMJ very much so that would probably be a great bullet choice also for the Brown Bear.

Yes the Sako is absolutely excellent but I would feel a bit better with control feed. I really love my Sako rifles by the way.

 

[spike.t]

The Sako front bead is way too big! Only good to fifty metres on buffalo, even that might be stretching it. I expect to be able to make good chest shots on buffalo out to 100m on buffalo. So both my Sakos got a finer bead fitted and then I was very happy!

Totally agree with you on the front sight being way too big. It's the only thing I don't like on my black bear.....where did you get the smaller bead or is it an option you can get from sako?

 

[BenKK]

Totally agree with you on the front sight being way too big. It's the only thing I don't like on my black bear.....where did you get the smaller bead or is it an option you can get from sako?

Not sure, Spike. I don’t think it’s an option from Sako, from memory. I sent it to a gunsmith and he made one, I think. Unless he sourced it from Rechnagl or NECG or something.

 

[Buckdog]

Win 70 with CRF all the way. Sako's shoot well, but I will go with the American classic all day every day!

 

[spike.t]

Not sure, Spike. I don’t think it’s an option from Sako, from memory. I sent it to a gunsmith and he made one, I think. Unless he sourced it from Rechnagl or NECG or something.

Ok thanks

 

[matt85]

between the two, 416 RM would be my choice. but a big part of that is the cartridge choice... im not a 416 Rigby fan. unless your goal is maximum speed the huge case capacity of the 416 Rigby serves only to increase recoil and waste powder. the 416 RM would do a better job of pushing a 400gr bullet at 2200-2300fps which is more then you really need any way.

-matt

 

[Dr Ray]

between the two, 416 RM would be my choice. but a big part of that is the cartridge choice... im not a 416 Rigby fan. unless your goal is maximum speed the huge case capacity of the 416 Rigby serves only to increase recoil and waste powder. the 416 RM would do a better job of pushing a 400gr bullet at 2200-2300fps which is more then you really need any way.

-matt

Agreed

 

[Scott CWO]

Winchester M70 for sure. A friend/guide in AK had a Sako bolt over-rotate and malfunction in the heat of battle on a wounded brown bear. Almost cost him his life. Bear chewed him up pretty good before it got sick enough that he could slink away. After the bolt malfunctioned, he kept the bear off his throat and head by sticking the rifle in the bears mouth as best he could. Bear chewed up his hands, took a big chunk out of his thigh and crushed his foot. After several surgeries, the doctors saved his foot but thought it would need amputation at first. CRF all the way on DG. Not worth the risk.

 

[steve white]

Glad to hear about the 85 being easy to disassemble--my av is not in that category. You can google the frustration many have had. Many gunsmiths seem a bit puzzled. Great guns, though (I have 2) so don't mean to nitpick too much.