8x68S owner's opinions

[Gert Odendaal]

IvW, I agree it really will be the best option,,,problem is nobody makes a barrel for a 8x68S in a 1:10 twist..only 1:11 twist..

 

[IvW]

8x57IS/IRS/8x64S 30 655 7.89 8.2 240 4
8x57IS/IRS/8x64S 30 744 7.89 8.2 240 4
8x57IS/IRS/8x64S 32 665 7.89 8.2 240 4
8x68S 30 655 7.89 8.2 280 4

Walther 1 in 9.5 and 1 in 11 available from Sabi rifles

1 in 9.5 may however be a bit too tight.

1 in 11 would be great for 224gr bullets.

 

[Gert Odendaal]

You are correct, although a barrel is expensive at SABI Arms..

 

[HWL]

Hi, can some tell me something about the Steyr-Mannlicher M72 in 8x68s? I just got one for 670 € in good condition. Was it an okay deal or?

Be aware of the M72's safety.... sometimes it engages easily....

HWL

 

[littlebear]

Be aware of the M72's safety.... sometimes it engages easily....

HWL

Thank you

 

[ZG47]

A faster twist, e.g. 1-10” will result in greater bullet drop, due to the fact that the increased rotational velocity results in greater aerodynamic friction, i.e. the bullet is working harder than necessary to get through the air AND SLOWS DOWN MORE QUICKLY. This is the opposite to what you want when selecting a heavy aerodynamically efficient bullet to make the most of your (relatively) high-velocity clambering.

This business of staying with the twist rate suitable for lower velocity cartridges has nothing to do with ballistic logic and appears to have everything to do with gunsmiths and gun makers in post World War II U.S.A. deliberately recommending and specifying the wrong, i.e. faster than appropriate, barrels so as to save themselves money. I very much doubt that the 8mm Remington would have had its reported issues with bullet blowup if Remington had fitted their rifles with 1-11” twist barrels.

If anyone wants to get a proper handle on this matter, I suggest that you look at the issues the British Army experienced when converting the various Enfield pattern rifles and carbines to the Snider pattern. One of the reasons why armies in the early 20th century rationalised the barrel lengths of their rifles and carbines was to utilise standard twist rates BUT what works for firearms with identical cartridge/chamber specs does not work when increasing propellant capacity by a third to a half.
.

 

[IvW]

Us Africans prefer heavy for caliber bullets and therefore require the correct twist to achieve that.

I do suspect that the 1 in 11 would be fine for the heavy 8mm in the 8x68S

 

[Gert Odendaal]

IvW while looking around for a barrel to purchase I got a quotation for a 8x68S barrel from Truvelo.

 

[mdwest]

Wow! Is that typical pricing to have a barrel made in SA? I think thats about $630 in USD... If Im reading the proforma correctly it looks like they want about $440 for the profiled barrel blank in 8mm.. and then another $107 to chamber it..

Would Truvelo be willing to cut a chamber on a barrel made by someone else?

You could pick up a 8mm barrel in the US from a quality manufacturer like Pac-Nor for about $275.. or from ER Shaw for as little as $160..

Even if you had to pay $100 to have it shipped it would be much less expensive..

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Mdwest, yes , items like a rifle barrel is extremely expensive in South Africa. The challenge is to be able to import permanently a barrel from the USA... there are a lot of red tape/ procedures to address when purchasing a barrel from the USA. Even importing a barrel through a gun shop is very difficult. I can purchase a barrel blank for much cheaper at a gun shop here but I still need to pay for the barrel profiling, chamber reaming to 8x68S chamber as you can see in this quotation.
I opted to purchase a 8x68S reamer in the USA and ask a friend/hunter to bring it to cut a chamber myself.
This will then take longer to complete the rifle build but there is no need for speed...
I can commence with making the rifle stock..and just complete the in letting when the barrel arrive and I completed cutting the chamber. But, yes, it is an expensive exercise purchasing a fall in barrel in our country..

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Looking at the web page of PAC-NOR I need to deposit $350 just to cover the administration fees..so this is not an viable option for me as a private owner onetime barrel importing exercise...
http://pac-nor.com/exporting/

 

[mdwest]

Pac-Nor's website is out of date.. The US State Department dropped all non military firearms and firearms components from their list of regulated export items in the past year.. Now the US Department of Commerce oversees exports of those items..

That said, I am sure they would still want a fee for completing the export license paperwork with the Dept. of Commerce.. so I'm guessing the cost would remain the same..

PM sent on another idea..

 

[Gert Odendaal]

It is good news to hear ...it will make things less complicated from the South African side and gun shops.

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Another aspect I noticed while doing some research in this regards is that few if any American barrel manufacturing company do have the 8x68S barrels ..only some have the 8x57JS ..there is a difference in rifling twist rate ...PAC-NOR as well as ER Shaw do not have the 8x68S barrels for sale

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Correction: PAC-NOR do make 8x68S barrels ..

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Here is some dimensions/measurements of a 8x68S barrel I need to purchase shortly from the company:
Pac-Nor Custom Barrel
Base Price 275
Caliber8mm .323
Chamber8 x 68 S
Chrome Moly Steel
Grade Standard-Match
Twist 5 groove10 twist
Contour No. 4
A 1.2
B 0.85
C 0.65
D 3
E 6
F 26
G 28
R 35
Finished Length 28
Crown 11 Degree
Finish Polished
Fluting no fluting
Type Prefit Barrel
Action Large Ring Mauser
Total Cost 400.00
Deposit Due with Order 200.00

Opinions/suggestions are more than welcome as usually..

 

[Gert Odendaal]

It seems there is some mis calculations and this barrel will be costing around $300 plus shipping will be $25 USA ...so it will be cheaper than the initial costs..what will be the best : a 3 groove 1;10 twist barrel or a 5 groove 1: 10 twist barrel???Please explain this to me??

 

[ZG47]

Three groove would possibly be better if you were shooting target bullets with short shanks and the relatively thin jackets of dedicated long distance target bullets, i.e. a thinner jacket means that any deviation in jacket thickness will have less effect on concentricity of the lead core thus enhancing accuracy. Less engraving by rifling would theoretically have less chance of distorting the bullet as it goes down the barrel and might even increase velocity slightly OR improve shot to shot velocity consistency.

The foregoing possibilities could matter for 500-1,000 yard shooting BUT not for hunting, in my opinion. If you ever want to stir up a group of target shooters, though, just raise the subject and then go 100 metres upwind so you do not have to listen to their squawking!

 

[mdwest]

Three groove would possibly be better if you were shooting target bullets with short shanks and the relatively thin jackets of dedicated long distance target bullets, i.e. a thinner jacket means that any deviation in jacket thickness will have less effect on concentricity of the lead core thus enhancing accuracy. Less engraving by rifling would theoretically have less chance of distorting the bullet as it goes down the barrel and might even increase velocity slightly OR improve shot to shot velocity consistency.

The foregoing possibilities could matter for 500-1,000 yard shooting BUT not for hunting, in my opinion. If you ever want to stir up a group of target shooters, though, just raise the subject and then go 100 metres upwind so you do not have to listen to their squawking!

I absolutely agree with @ZG47

3 vs 5 is a big debate among bench rest shooters, snipers, 1000 yard competitive shooters, etc... and even the "experts" among those groups really cant decide which is better... they will fight about 3 vs 5 longer than CCW pistol guys will argue 9mm vs .45 ACP..

For the average hunter who just wants sub MOA accuracy out of a gun that they might shoot 400 yards tops (realistically less than 200 yards most of the time).. I really dont think 3 vs 5 matters..

 

[Gert Odendaal]

Thank you for your input ZG47 , it is much appreciated..yes I want to build this rifle first as a hunting rifle and still be able to use it for Ghong shoot competitions ....range out to 400 meters will be my aim...usually ghongs shoots are up to 300 meters ...I am not extremely proficient at long range shooting ..but I really want to see what I will be able to achieve with this 8x68S rifle I am building...