Double Rifle Purchase Advice

[ar15meister]

I am in the market for a Double in a dangerous game caliber. I have hunted Buffalo before in Africa and I want to go back to hunt Buffalo again and want a nice Buffalo rifle. I am booking a Dagestan Tur hunt in Azerbaijan for this summer to follow up my recent Ibex hunt in October 2017 in lovely Kyrgyzstan so I wont likely be Buffalo hunting this year unless a last minute too good deal comes up. I am planning to hunt Buffalo again in 2019 or 2020 in either Zimbabwe/Mozambique or Zambia.

I don't really have a price range but I wouldn't want to spend more than 10-12k. I would be open to something pre-owned, vintage, actually pretty much anything to be honest.

A local dealer I like and respect has just sent me a .500NE Sabatti, brand new production, that he has asked me to hold and to check out. It hasn't arrived from the carrier yet. The price is good at $4200USD but I have heard mixed reviews on them. The dealer, who I have bought many nice guns from, said that these new ones are good rifles, for what they are. They shoot more than well enough to handle the job of cleanly killing Buffalo. I like to spend money on hunts and other rifles, etc so cost is always a consideration in my mind as a businessman. I have also looked at Merkels and Kriegoffs.

Anyways I know nothing about doubles and I am not a "gun guy" aside from enjoying hunting and shooting as a passion. Given my home location and business hours I have limited time and chances to shoot rifles (I am in Toronto, Canada- very urban/liberal.

Opinions from those in the know are appreciated.

One last thing- I can order a brand new Rigby bolt gun in .416 Rigby or .450 Rigby for about 9500 Canadian which is about $7500USD give or take. That is also a tempting offer and I would like an opinion from some of the members here.

Probably in the end I will end up having a good business year and buying both! LOL. That is often my solution to problems like this. But I have 2 sons and I want to make sure I have lots of good rifles around for the "future", which I see being littered with father son pack trips and safaris (in my dreams both night and day).

Respectfully,

Adam.

 

[CAustin]

I have heard the same about the new Sabatti rifles. Let us know what yo7 think once you have it in your hands. I purchased a used Merkel and can tell you that it is regulated very well and is as tight as a tick.
Fellow AH member @cal pappas has some classic rifles for sale. Look in the free classified section.

 

[sierraone]

@ar15meister Sir, I just bought my first DR, so I am not one to be advising you on what to buy. BUT, in your post you said you can buy a new Rigby Big Game in .416 or .450 for about $7500 U.S. I do know about Rigbys though. For a new Rigby in those calibers, we in the U.S. have to pay around $15000 for the base model. If you don't mind telling, how?where? can you find a new Rigby for $7500. That is a steal. The only thing I can think of is that Canadians don't have to pay some of the import/excise taxes from England as we do here. Please explain, if you will!

 

[ar15meister]

@ar15meister Sir, I just bought my first DR, so I am not one to be advising you on what to buy. BUT, in your post you said you can buy a new Rigby Big Game in .416 or .450 for about $7500 U.S. I do know about Rigbys though. For a new Rigby in those calibers, we in the U.S. have to pay around $15000 for the base model. If you don't mind telling, how?where? can you find a new Rigby for $7500. That is a steal. The only thing I can think of is that Canadians don't have to pay some of the import/excise taxes from England as we do here. Please explain, if you will!

10k Canadian for one of the PH models from the Canadian dealers is my understanding from 2 separate dealers.

Feel free to message me and I can send you the dealer's info.

Thank you.

 

[Bullthrower338]

If you can get Rigby Big Games at 7500 US I will take 3

 

[ar15meister]

If you can get Rigby Big Games at 7500 US I will take 3

LOL...So call the Canadian dealers and buy 3 for, as I said, $7500 give or take. I know for a fact they have an 'optioned' one asking 12,900 CAD in stock right now chambered in .416 Rigby and they told me they could order me one in the 9500-10500 CANADIAN range with less options like case hardening, etc. Maybe the guy was wrong.....But I know for a fact they have one sitting there for 12,900 CAD right now....I am pretty sure that is under 10k USD. definitely not 15,000USD.

Maybe its due to the Britain/Canada trade deal that we signed recently after all the Trump NAFTA stuff. No idea to be honest.

But as far as my original question, is your suggestion that I should buy a Rigby in the 9500-10500 CAD range over a Sabatti or a similar double?

I really need advice and opinions on that particular item from people who know more than I do.

 

[mdwest]

If given the choice between a $4200 USD Sabatti or a $9500 CAD Rigby... I'd be all over that Rigby like stink on a baboons butt..

That said.. If I knew where to pick up a Sabatti Big 5 for $4200 USD, somewhere here in the US, I would be pulling my checkbook out right now.. That is also an excellent deal (if you like Sabatti)..

$4200 is the lowest price I've heard of on a new Big 5.. Most I have seen on GB and GA have been north of that number by a couple of thousand dollars..

 

[ar15meister]

If given the choice between a $4200 USD Sabatti or a $9500 CAD Rigby... I'd be all over that Rigby like stink on a baboons butt..

That said.. If I knew where to pick up a Sabatti Big 5 for $4200 USD, somewhere here in the US, I would be pulling my checkbook out right now.. That is also an excellent deal (if you like Sabatti)..

$4200 is the lowest price I've heard of on a new Big 5.. Most I have seen on GB and GA have been north of that number by a couple of thousand dollars..

I don't know what particular model ( I don't think it is the BIG FIVE- doesn't that one have engraving of big 5 animals?). I have pics from the dealer I cant post them I don't know how. Cost to me on the Sabatti is $5800CAD asking.... it was a cancellation order and I believe retail is in the 7k-7.5k range.

 

[mdwest]

I think it would have to be a Big 5 or a Big 5 EDL.. the only other double they make (SxS) that I am aware of is the 92, which I think only comes in non nitro express calibers like 9.3x74, 8x57JRS, etc..

The 92's are a good bit less expensive than their NE chambered guns (the few I have seen have been less than $4K here in the US)..

They also make a couple of O/U doubles that are a little bit cheaper than the Big 5 and Big 5 EDL.. its possible thats what he is offering for $5800 CAD?

 

[Bullthrower338]

LOL...So call the Canadian dealers and buy 3 for, as I said, $7500 give or take. I know for a fact they have an 'optioned' one asking 12,900 CAD in stock right now chambered in .416 Rigby and they told me they could order me one in the 9500-10500 CANADIAN range with less options like case hardening, etc. Maybe the guy was wrong.....But I know for a fact they have one sitting there for 12,900 CAD right now....I am pretty sure that is under 10k USD. definitely not 15,000USD.

Maybe its due to the Britain/Canada trade deal that we signed recently after all the Trump NAFTA stuff. No idea to be honest.

But as far as my original question, is your suggestion that I should buy a Rigby in the 9500-10500 CAD range over a Sabatti or a similar double?

I really need advice and opinions on that particular item from people who know more than I do.

A double is a personal decision, I always dreamt of having one and finally acquired a Merkel in 470 NE and really like it. I have been around quite a few Sabatti doubles lately and everyone that owns one seems to really like them. The first ones to hit the US had severe regulation issues but from all I have ever read this seemed to be limited to the 450/400 rifles. I haven’t heard of the 470 or 500’s having issue.
Now to the Rigby question. Had I walked into the store and had my choice of a Big Game or the Merkel and the Rigby was under 10k, I wouldn’t have been able to write a check fast enough to buy the 416R. I would have then started saving again for a double. Both rifle designs touch a nerve in the brain when it comes to African hunting and it just depends which one runs deeper in you mind. A Merkel is by no means comparable to a Rising Bite but a Rigby Big Game is a lot more feasible to a man of meager means as myself and fills that “need” in my mind(and in my hands). I will own a big game one day hopefully and a highland stalker in 275 to go along with it. The quest for the perfect rifle battery will never be fulfilled, at least I hope not because it is so damn fun trying to get there.
Good luck,
Cody

 

[ar15meister]

I think it would have to be a Big 5 or a Big 5 EDL.. the only other double they make (SxS) that I am aware of is the 92, which I think only comes in non nitro express calibers like 9.3x74, 8x57JRS, etc..

The 92's are a good bit less expensive than their NE chambered guns (the few I have seen have been less than $4K here in the US)..

They also make a couple of O/U doubles that are a little bit cheaper than the Big 5 and Big 5 EDL.. its possible that's what he is offering for $5800 CAD?

I asked the dealer in an email and he said the model was the Safari Classic. I have pics and they look like this but I am not sure which model it is.

This is the big five so maybe it is, in fact, a brand new Big Five. It looks like this.

http://www.sabatti.it/en/products/safari-big-five-hunting-rifles/

 

[mdwest]

That same gun typically goes much higher than $4500 here in the US....


https://www.gunsamerica.com/903801642/Sabatti-Big-Five-Classic-Safari-500-N-.htm

 

[Spooksar]

A few weeks ago there was a Merkel 470 double for sale at Wolverine Supplies in Manitoba for $7999. Good rifle, well regulated and worth every penny, I’ve had mine for 15 years and would not part with it.

 

[treedog61]

Recently, someone on here offered a new Heym 88B in 450/400. If I remember right, he was asking $14,500.

 

[cagkt3]

I'd buy the Rigby and the Sabatti - that's right in budget, and 2 guns for under $12,000!

 

[IvW]

I would not buy a Sabatti, irrespective of the price, unless only used on PG.

If you plan as you mention in your op that you are coming back for only buffalo and you want to hunt with a double, I would suggest a VC in caliber 450/400 3", it has been the best caliber for buffalo in a double rifle since it was introduced. Low in recoil, light to carry and very effective on buffalo.

VC will build you one to your measurements(fit with a double rifle is the most important) you can also choose from a whole lot of different extras.

 

[Philip Glass]

I too hunted Kyrgyzstan and want to hunt Tur soon. I just got a Kreighoff .470. I like the features they have that others don’t. They only cock the hammers when switch is moved to fire and it has an anti doubling feature. They are expensive but used can be found around $10K. In the world of double guns very reasonable. I plan to hunt rhino with it first then buffalo later.
Philip

 

[ar15meister]

I bought the Sabatti.

Fit and finish is better than expected. It is nicely balanced, for me, and snaps to the shoulder nicely.

Hopefully it shoots well enough.

I was able to negotiate the price down to $5500 CAD (which is $4200USD shipped to my door).

Still enough room to the Rigby Highland Stalker in .275 Rigby if I want to really piss off my wife.

How is .275 Rigby as a plains game caliber?

 

[matt85]

my Sabatti was absolute junk, hopefully yours is MUCH better then mine!

-matt

 

[Red Leg]

If you can afford to purchase a Sabatti, then save a bit more money and get a K-Gun or Heym or VC. I am a big fan of the Krieghoff. It is inherently very accurate, very safe, and can easily be configured with optics.

The .500 is a terrible buffalo caliber. Not because it won't shoot them dead as dead can be, but it is like carrying around a piece of railroad iron or a crew-served weapon. That is why John A. Hunter had a gun bearer.

Krieghoff's 500/ 416 is, on the other hand, perfect buffalo medicine in their double (as is the classic .470). I am also a huge fan of the Blaser S2. No longer in production, they can be had at very reasonable prices on the used market. Like the K-Gun, they are inherently safe, incredibly accurate, and easily accommodate optics. I have used mine to take everything from duiker to cape buffalo.