SOUTH AFRICA: Shingani - Scam Outfitter

Discussion in 'Hunting Reports' started by gobble50, Sep 2, 2010.

  1. enysse

    enysse AH Ambassador

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    I would like to hear a full hunting report. I grew up listening to Paul Harvey....and would like to hear the "rest of the story". I have heard a lot of hunting reports from guys going to Africa the first time, over the phone this year....and being unhappy....from different outfitters...asked what the problem was ?....and it was money....they never thought hunting cost so much....they thought they could go to Africa on the cheap.....And I hate penny pinchers that whine and complain about the cost of hunting...if you can't afford it stay home. Save your money and do your homework....and don't blame the outfitter for not cutting you a "deal" when you arrive in Africa....As a outfitter I would be pissed too.
  2. AfricaHunting.com

    AfricaHunting.com FOUNDER AH Ambassador

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    Just sent another email to Shingani Safaris in case the first one did not get to them...
  3. Big5

    Big5 AH Enthusiast

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    Jim . . . I agree. I too would like to hear a few specifics of the OP's complaint.

    Ron . . . I disagree. No one is asking for the OP's 'name, rank and serial number' or other any other identifying information. That being the case, I certainly DO NOT understand the reluctance of the OP to elaborate or continue the discussion. He's anonymously pointed a finger and made general allegations of dishonesty toward someone. I for one say; okay, you may maintain your anonymity, but have the gumption to step forward and support your finger pointing with a few specifics.

    For all any of us know at this point it MAY be a simple case of too high expectations, being out of shape physically, or perhaps inexperience and low shooting skills. A few details may just provide the answer.
  4. Ron Duval

    Ron Duval Guest

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    I too am curious, and wish more information was made available. It would have been a good idea for the OP to state his case more clearly, but some of the posts made by people here have probably made the OP decide that it was not worth it to continue with this group. No one here knows where the problems between the OP and Shingani lie, or the cause. The problems could have started with either party (or both).
    Jerome is clearly doing the right thing by asking both sides to clear this up, but it seems likely that it will remain a mystery.
  5. KMG Hunting Safaris

    KMG Hunting Safaris SPONSOR AH Elite

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    I'm thinking that should the OP not reply to any of this, supporting a claim that the accusation is false, then maybe it would be a wise idea to remove this thread. Its causing damage to the outfitter involved, which might be non warranted. There might be readers who dont go through the effort to read all the posts and only see the bad. Feel it will be unfair on the outfitter.
    Just a thought.
  6. Big5

    Big5 AH Enthusiast

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    I feel obliged to follow up my last post with an example of my reason for requesting addition information when it comes to complaints about an outfitter.

    Several years ago a buddy and I were hunting the KD1 area of the Kalahari Desert in Botswana. We shared camp with another hunter and his companion who was a non hunter. My buddy and I had a great time each and every day and we had no difficulty punching the ticket on every animal on our respective wish lists. The other hunter we shared camp with was not having a good time. At the end of each day this hunter and his friend would return to camp empty handed and he would begin grumbling and groaning about what a crappy day he’d had.

    We came to learn that for whatever reason this hunter simply couldn’t hit his ass with both hands. He had a variety of excuses that ranged from poor ammunition, sights being knocked off, a sticky trigger assembly and the PH’s inability to locate game and position him within a proper shooting range (whatever he felt that was). Day after day this hunter had no success and he would continue returning to camp each evening in a progressively worse mood than the day before.

    I’m sure his inability to hit what he aimed at wasn’t the only reason for his terrible mood. The overall situation must have been heightened because his audience to all those missed shots was the non hunting companion he was obviously trying to impress. In any event this guy became an insufferable jerk that my buddy and I along with the entire camp staff would avoid at all cost. I must add that by the end of the ten day hunt this hunter had still not connected and dropped a single animal.

    A few weeks after that hunt my buddy and I were both contacted by the outfitter. We were asked about the conditions of camp, the staff, the food and the abundance of game we had encountered. We both assured the outfitter that we found everything to be great other than the presence of the other hunter and his loud and incessant grumbling each evening. We further told the outfitter that we most especially enjoyed the abundance of game and the opportunity to successfully complete our respective wish lists days before our hunt ended.

    The outfitter then went on to tell us that his reason for inquiring was a letter he’d received from the other hunter. This hunter was demanding a full refund for the hunt due to poor camp conditions, poor food, a poor PH, and the absence of game in the area. We found the last allegation to be particularly absurd. But having been around this hunter I would imagine he also complained about sand in his shoes, boogers in his nose and itchy hemorrhoids, all of which were due to the outfitter. But there certainly was no absence of game in the area. With our wish lists completed my buddy and I spent our final couple of days shooting 12 additional ‘freebie’ animals as foodstuff for the local village. Game was obviously abundant.

    However, this hunter went on to threaten the outfitter by saying that if a refund was not received he was going to report his overall 'poor hunting experience' to his local SCI chapter, SCI International and to various internet hunting sites.

    Although long winded that's why I personally take general accusations with a grain of salt. Without a few details or specifics the accusation remains hollow. . . Besides, without details I could never really be sure that the accuser wasn’t that same obnoxious and insufferable guy I shared camp with in Botswana years ago. LOL. But I’ll wager that to this day he still can’t hit his ass with both hands as I believe his impatience and anger won’t allow him to master a proper shooting technique
  7. browningbbr

    browningbbr AH Enthusiast

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    This thread is another example of why I like this forum so much. When "charged" topics get posted, several things happen:
    1. Both sides of the story are pursued.
    2. A true search for the facts gets started.
    3. Cooler heads prevail
    4. Past, related experiences from PH's and clients get cited
    5. Experienced hunters try to see the problem through the eyes of the outfitter
    6. Experienced outfitters try to see the problem through the eyes of the client
    7. There's genuine respect for reasoned opinions

    It's just as much fun watching the process (and learning from it) as it is participating in the conversation!

    Oh yeah, I forgot one:
    8. enysse will inject a humorous comment or a dose of reality that makes me laugh out loud

    Thanks guys!

    - browningbbr
  8. enysse

    enysse AH Ambassador

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    There are certain people that like to play the blame game...and it is impossible to keep them happy...having worked with a few individuals....you are 100% correct these individuals are a cancer to society.
  9. enysse

    enysse AH Ambassador

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    Thanks Browning bbr, you made my day!
  10. Koedoeberg

    Koedoeberg AH Veteran

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    I think the best way to contact the outfitter would be to phone him .
    I am sure he would want to respond but how does he know who the client is that is unhappy ? Maybe the client left without a face to face complaint.

    This is a difficult situation for other people to figure out without all the info.
  11. Outfitter Shingani

    Outfitter Shingani New Member

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    RIAAN VOSLOO OUTFITTER SHINGANI SAFARIS

    IT WAS WITH GREAT DISBELIEF THAT I VIEWED THE POSTING AFTER CONCERNED MEMBERS E MAILED ME TO LET ME KNOW ABOUT THE COMPLAINT ON THE FORUM.
    UNFORTUNATELY I HAVE BEEN HUNTING IN BOTH SOUTH AFRICA AND IN ZIMBABWE FOR MOST OF THE YEAR AND COULD NOT REPLY.

    I HAVE BEEN AN OUTFITTER FOR THE LAST 12 YEARS. IN THIS TIME I HAVE HUNTED MORE THAN 700 CLIENTS IN SOUTH AFRICA AND MORE THAN 100 CLIENTS FOR BUFFALO, LION AND ELEPHANT. I RUN MY OWN TAXIDMERY AND ALL TROPHIES ARE EITHER DIP AND SHIPPED BY US OR MOUNTED BY US HERE FOR MY CLIENTS.

    IN THE LAST 12 YEARS I HAVE HAD THE MINIMUM COMPLAINTS. NONE OF THESE WERE NOT SORTED OUT WHILE CLIENTS WERE NOT STIL HUNTING . THESE WERE MORE REQUESTS THAN COMPLAINS, THINGS LIKE " I WOULD LIKE TO EAT LUNCH IN THE BUSH " OR " CAN WE GET A HAIR DRYER FOR MY WIFE IN THE ROOM"

    I AM SITTING HERE AND TRYING HARD TO THINK IF ANY CLIENT HAS EVER LEFT HERE WITH NOT MORE ANIMLAS THAN HE OR SHE CAME FOR. MOST EVERYBODY SHOT MORE THAN THEY BOOKED, NOBODY HAS LEFT WITHOUT GOOD TROPHIES. WE HAVE 1 OF THE BEST HUNTING AREAS IN SOUTH AFRCIA, ANIMALS ARE PLENTY.

    I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHO THIS PERSON " GOBBLE 50 " IS. AS I THINK HE HAS NOT HUNTED WITH ME AND THIS IS A SCAM TO DISCREDIT ME.

    HUNTERS THAT HAVE HUNTED IN THE ELLISRAS LIMPOPON REGION WILL ALL TELL YOU THAT THIS IS NOT POSSIBLE TO ONLY SEE 1 IMPALA DURING YOUR HUNT. ANUBODY THAT HAS BEEN HERE WILL KNOW THIS IS A LIE. !!!! YOU WIL SEE 200 + IMPALA EVERYDAY, IT DOES NOT MATTER WITH WHICH OUTFIT YOU HAV EHUNTED OR ARE GOING TO HUNT. THE AREA HAS THE MOST GAME PERIOD. ALL MY CLIENTS SHOOT BIG KUDU, WE PRIDE OURSELFS IN THE KUDU WE SHOOT, THIS YEAR WE SHOT 35 KUDU BULLS WITH AN AVARAGE OF 52". I DO NOT KNOW 1 CLIENT THAT HUNTED WITH ME THAT LEFT WITHOUT A BIG KUDU, NOT 1.

    IN 2009 THE PSE BOW GROUP OF 12 HUNTERS SHOT 72 HEAD OF GAME IN 6 DAYS WITH THE BOW. IF BOW HUNTERS CAN DO THIS IN 7 DAYS, THEN THERE IS NO LACK OF GAME.


    I AM WILLING TO SUPPLY ANYBODY WITH MORE THAN 200 NAMES OF CLIENTS THAT HUNTED WITH ME IN ONLY THE PAST 4 YEARS TO CONTACT THEM AND ASK THEM ABOUT OUR OUTFIT.

    WE RUN A HONEST TOP CLASS HUNTING OUTFIT WITH MORE TROPHY GAME AVAILABLE THAN WE CAN GET CLIENTS.

    WELL KNOWN PEOPLE IN THE HUNTING INDUSTRY THAT HUNTED WITH US AND HAD US ON THEIR TV SHOWS AND STIL HUNT WITH US ARE.

    PETE SHIPLEY, OWNER PSE
    JIMMY HOUSTON, JIMMY HOUSTON PRODUCTIONBS.
    RICK MOWERY , BOHNING ARCHERY
    BILL EAPARDS, PSE
    STEVES OUTDOOR ADVENTURES,
    HUNTING WITH THE JUDGE. CLIENT JASON SMIT
    GARY LEWIS OUTDOORS.

    WITH THIS I REST MY CAES AND WOULD LIKE TO WAIT AND HEAR FROM WHOM THESE
    ALLIGATIONS CAME.

    THANK YOU FOR EVERYBODY THAT DID NOT JUST ACCEPT WHAT IS POSTED ON THIS FORUM TO BE THE TRUTH. THANK YOU FOR ALL THE PEOPLE WHO E MAILED US BEING CONCERNED ABOUT OUR REPUTATION.

    I LOOK FORWARD TO HEAR FROM GOBBLE 50.

    ANYBODY THAT WANT TO CONTACT ME CAN E MAIL ME.
    I WIL BE LEAVING SOUTH AFRICA FOR A HUNT IN ZIMBABWE ON SATURDAY AND WIL BE BACK 18TH OCTOBER. THANK YOU
    RIAAN VOSLOO
  12. KMG Hunting Safaris

    KMG Hunting Safaris SPONSOR AH Elite

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    Riaan, Thanks for replying. Once the poster never replied on anything, I think the whole forum knew something was up. An accusation like this is a serious one. Just from your experience, I recognise you as a top operator. I truly hope this fool has not caused you too much damage.
    All the best on your next trip.

    Kind Regards
    Marius Goosen
  13. Bushbuck

    Bushbuck AH Enthusiast

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    Riaan,
    I would not be to concerned. Some people feel any publicity is good publicity. This was a heck of a introduction to everyone on this forum. I didn't know who you were before this thread. Now look at how many people have been exposed to your operation.
    Anyone worth having as a client is smart enough to see thru the original post.
    If this thread was planned out by you I would say it has been successful, lol. Looking at how things have been going lately and the amount of people lining up to hunt with Sullivan these days, I would say the next best thing will be if SCI, PHASA or some other group also comes out and condemn's you.

    All kidding aside, good luck to you and welcome.
  14. trigger creep

    trigger creep AH Enthusiast

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    Since gobble 50 has not replied and Shingani has, I am inclined to believe that Shingani IS NOT a "scam outfitter". It appears to me that Shingani is a reputable outfitter.


    BTW, With how this thread is going, Jerome should charge Shingani for advertisement! LOL, just kidding.
  15. monish

    monish AH Elite

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    Christian,

    You said it all right ... few unethical & odd hunters believe in the blame game being themselves at the lawful part & thats damn too sad to tarnish image of a professional hunter ..............

    Monish
  16. Roscoe

    Roscoe New Member

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    High folks....a new guy here. I wanted to jump in and insure anyone reading this thread that Riaan Vosloo and Shingani Safaris are great people to do business. I started hunting with Riaan 12 years ago when he was first starting his business. He was a hard working outfitter then and has taken his operation to even higher levels now. I have returned to hunt with Riaan and his family nearly every year and plan to do so for many days to come. Last year his oldest boy took me hunting....what a treat it is to watch him grow up.....the boy was not even born when I made my first trip. Riaan, his father, brother, and wife are like family to me. Yes I am bias however anyone who has met him knows this accusation is false. The person who started this thread has attempted to extort money from Shingani. He continues to threaten Shingani safaris with slander unless Riaan pays him to stop. It is really a pathetic situation that unfortunately is becoming more and more frequent with the popularity of Forums like this.

    Although I am new here, I do frequent other Hunting related Forums and know that the regulars to these places often smell a rat very quickly. This is very evident in this thread as almost immediately people began to question the validity of the original post. Regardless, Riaan is concerned that some may take this for real. I honestly can’t blame him. He like many other PH’s in Africa have spent a lot of time and money building a successful business. They take pride in what they offer their clients and their reputation is of the upmost importance. I honestly feel it is far more common for the PH’s to get screwed, than the client. This is clearly the case here. Let’s hope this thread dies with my post.

    Warm Regards,

    Roscoe
  17. ThomasBeaham

    ThomasBeaham BRONZE SUPPORTER AH Enthusiast

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    This post does not pass the smell test.
    I for one am beginning to believe that there are three sides to this story.

    Roscoe,
    A 10 year old boy took you hunting? Impossible? No. Improbable? No. Unusual, I would guess HIGHLY.

    Two days before your post Riaan posted " I would like to know who this person"Gobble50" is. As I think he has not hunted with me and this is a scam to discredit me." Roscoe, your post infers that "Gobble50" is attempting to extort Shingani, and is continuing to threaten Shingani safaris unless Riaan pays him to stop.
    So according to you(Roscoe), Riaan now knows who "Gobble50" is. When did this become apparent? I would highly encourage you or Riaan to put a name to this "Gobble50" so other prospective PH's will know who he is.
    Can you name him or is this whole thread a publicity stunt?
  18. Roscoe

    Roscoe New Member

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    Yes the boy took me hunting. He is 11 now and quite the little hunter.
    You are correct that in the beginning Riaan was not aware who started this. Since that time the individual has sent info to Riaan asking for money. So yes we now know who he is. I saw the email that was sent. I will let Riaan decide if the name should be made public along with the "Rest Of The Story". It's pretty good. Riaan may decide to refrain due to the pending legal action he is taking. I do think a name would be helpful to prevent this from happening to anyone else.

    Cheers

    Roscoe
  19. Roscoe

    Roscoe New Member

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    Here is a recent photo of my 11 years old PH Rynu and the croc he shot in Zim a few months ago. The rifle in his hands is a M-70 416 Remington. They were hunting buffalo and had the opportunity on the croc.
    [​IMG]

    Thomas,
    In the event you have not figured this out, Taking me on a hunt was kind of like a right of passage for Rynu. As noted in my earlier post, Riaan is like a brother to me. He is family. On my last trip I told Riaan that I was looking forward to the day when Rynu would be the one taking me on hunts....rather than his old man. Riaan decided to make it happen the next day. The two of us went out after Impala for the afternoon. Unfortunately we did not connect on a ram....but I did not care the slightest....it was another hunt I will always remember.

    Cheers
  20. Bushbuck

    Bushbuck AH Enthusiast

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    Riaan may be the best outfitter in Africa, but this is certainly a weird thread. It sounded as though he didn't know who this was when he posted, now just a couple days later he already has legal action pending against this guy and extortion is something I am not use to hearing against a PH.
    I also don't believe we can call an 11 year old a PH.

    Roscoe, I know you are trying to help your friend out here, but maybe it is time for someone to just come clean and tell the truth. Is this a past hunter looking for a refund that you are now calling extortion, or is this an unknown person on the Internet looking to gain money.
    Extortion accusations are strong words, you say its a great story. do tell..

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