SOUTH AFRICA: Question for Tootabi Hunting Safaris

Discussion in 'Hunting Reports' started by fvh40, Mar 17, 2014.

  1. fvh40

    fvh40 AH Veteran

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    Hi Boet.

    Is it legal to advertise if YOU'RE not a licensed OUTFITTER.

    Good luck with you're PH course..
     
  2. BnC 04

    BnC 04 TITANIUM SUPPORTER SILVER SUPPORTER AH Enthusiast

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    If it's a direct question for Tootabi, why not just PM him your question???
     
  3. LeopardsValleySafaris

    LeopardsValleySafaris AH Senior Member

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    Well, because he is conducting illegal hunts. All his past and present US clients can be subject to a LACEY ACT violation. They can be prosecuted and have all their trophies confiscated.

    Below my post to a hunt offer on another forum.


    I have just got of the Phone with Jaap Pienaar, head of the Eastern Cape Department of Environmental affairs wildlife crime.

    You have been advertising now for a few years without a valid OUTFITTERS licence or PH licence. You have only now recently got a 3 month temporary Outfitters licence.

    To date you still do not have a valid PH licence yet you are advertising that YOU will be the PH on this Safari.

    I also know that Tootabi Valley Safaris owner Gerrit du Preez (Beans) has sent you a lawyers letter that you are in copyright violation of his registered company , registerd in 2009.
    This letter you have ignored.

    You were also sent a lawyers letter By Carl van Zyl of John X Safaris for copyright violation as you copied his website verbatim.

    You are young and ambitious but in this trade you cannot step on the people around you to get ahead. I would send you a PM but you are hell bent on bucking the system.

    stop advertising hunts, go do your PH, get your OWN name and start a legitimate business.


    Dave Davenport
    leopardsvalley.co.za
    dave@leopardsvalley.co.za
    +27 42 24 61388
    HUNT WHILE YOU ARE STILL ABLE
     
  4. Hartzview Hunting Safaris

    Hartzview Hunting Safaris SPONSOR AH Fanatic

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    I really do not want to get involved here as it is none of my business.

    But I would like to mention again to many clients out there that it is showed time after time that cheaper and cheapest is not always the best and always have a surprise some where a long the line......

    I hope this can be cleared up for the clients that already paid deposits......

    Best regards,

    Jacques
     
  5. Paw Print

    Paw Print SPONSOR AH Fanatic

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    Same here,I do not want to get involved, shows the importance of checking references and documentation.
     
  6. LeopardsValleySafaris

    LeopardsValleySafaris AH Senior Member

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    The Big problem for those that have paid deposits, they have been sold on a lie. All past clients have to check their paperwork and see who the ACTUAL PH and OUTFITTER is as HE IS ALSO LIABLE for prosecution for falsifying documents.
     
  7. Jaco Strauss

    Jaco Strauss AH Elite

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    I have to agree with everyone here....

    BnC 04 this is a public forum, of which the credibility should stand without contestation and or suspicion.

    Before we jump to conclusions Loodt, should be able to state his case....PUBLICLY as he has posted multiple safari packages, this should only be seen as being fair, on a public forum such as this, and to any and all member and visitors to AH, wether this be the truth or not.

    My best always.
     
  8. Hartzview Hunting Safaris

    Hartzview Hunting Safaris SPONSOR AH Fanatic

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    I might want to rephrase my comment as it might be understood in a wrong manner.

    Nothing I said is linked or aimed Tootabi or Loodt, I have in general seen so many times that when very good priced packages are marketed there is a hick up most of the time.

    Loodt needs to be able to put his side of the story on here as well like Jaco said as every story has 2 sides to it.

    I will say again that I hope this can be cleared as there is some of my good friends that is scheduled to hunt with this company.

    Thank you and I apologize if I stepped on any toes at all.

    Best regards,

    Jacques
     
  9. BnC 04

    BnC 04 TITANIUM SUPPORTER SILVER SUPPORTER AH Enthusiast

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    I agree with you Jaco 100%. I guess I just read the main thread header and felt it may be easier to utilze the PM system. However, being transparient is of the utmost importance when dealing with legal issues of any sorts. Hope Loodt can shed some light on this for all of us.

    Take care,
    Nathan
     
  10. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR GOLD BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    Appreciate your concern Dave.
     
  11. AfricaHunting.com

    AfricaHunting.com FOUNDER AH Ambassador

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    Just to let everyone know I emailed earlier today Loodt Buchner of Tootabi Hunting Safaris asking him to reply publicly to this thread and that a prompt reply was expected.

    For now I "soft" deleted all of Tootabi Hunting Safaris offers posted in the GREAT DEALS on Hunts Worldwide section of the forum.
     
  12. gi jane

    gi jane BRONZE SUPPORTER AH Enthusiast

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    Hi Jerome, just a quick question; Do you ever sleep my friend? Stay well. Thank you for your hard work and this wonderful forum.
     
  13. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR GOLD BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    ..and because Ferdi knows the answer to the question already.


    CHAPTER VIA

    PROFESSIONAL HUNTERS AND HUNTING CONTRACTORS

    [Chapter VIA inserted by s. 25 of Ord. 15 of 1983.]

    Definitions.

    72A For the purposes of this Chapter

    (a) Professional hunter means a person who, for reward, offers to escort some other person not normally resident in the Republic, the Territory of South West Africa or a territory which formerly formed part of the Republic, in order to enable such other person to hunt a wild animal, and

    (b) Hunting contractor means a person who, for reward, offers or organises the hunting of a wild animal to or for some other person not normally resident in the Republic, the Territory of South West Africa or a territory which formerly formed part of the Republic.

    Permit to act as professional hunter or hunting contractor.

    72B Subject to the provisions of any regulations made under section 72C (a), no person shall act as a professional hunter or hunting contractor without a permit.



    Penalty.

    72D Subject to the provisions of section 86 (2) every person who contravenes the provisions of section 72B shall be guilty of an offence and shall be liable on conviction in accordance with the provisions of section 86 (1) (b).
     
  14. enysse

    enysse AH Ambassador

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    If there is a problem, I'm glad Ferdi brought to everyone's attention...potentially a big problem to any customer.
     
  15. spike.t

    spike.t GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    just wondering how come nobody brought it up before, as loodt has been on here and offering hunts for a few months now. its not as if he was under the radar in fact the opposite.......its not as if ferdi, jacques and dave cant have seen his hunt offers before today? as i said curious as to why nobody brought it up before? (just to make clear i am not defending or accusing here, just wondering)
     
  16. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR GOLD BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    I comprehend your reluctance.

    Guys, you are already involved.
    You make a living in the industry, you are members of AH.


    If you do not want to post a concern directly, I will be more than happy to assist you.PM me!
    I will make every effort to assist by sharing the information with the membership after I have had my own look around.

    When anyone has a complaint I try to ask the individual involved to post their reply.
    Most folks want to reply to reasonable concerns.
     
  17. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR GOLD BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    I'll play devils advocate.

    Just noticed a FB entry for October 2013 of a hunt offer.
    No idea where the historical advertising you state was taking place? Not here or other internet forums I know of.

    If he has an Outfitter permit as you note, he can arrange hunts, quite LEGALLY.
    In earlier hunt offers on AH I noted two different PH's names, (not Loodt). (as well as on FB)

    "To date", no PH license.
    Wish him luck in school to get his license. Perhaps, by the time he will be acting as a PH he'll have a license.
    Mean while he can hire other PH's.

    Perhaps his lawyer advised him to ignore it.
    If there is an actionable matter I am sure "Beans" will make a plan with his lawyer.
    If he's ignoring a court judgement, I've got an issue


    In comparing the web pages, it appears that someone liked the basic design elements for sure. I could not find the verbatim duplication you suggest though.

    Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
    It happens to AH, all the time.
    As a matter of fact there are several outfitters, etc in RSA that have a nearly identical web addresses to AH.



    All in all, glad you guys are willing to ask and answer questions.
    I look forward to Tootabi Hunting Safaris response.
     
  18. Jaco Strauss

    Jaco Strauss AH Elite

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    Spike not being based and not operating in the eastern cape neither myself and or Jacques was aware of this.

    As members of this site this has been a surprise to us as well.

    My best always
     
  19. Tootabi Valley Safaris

    Tootabi Valley Safaris AH Member

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    Hi Guys.
    I am better know to all as Beans.
    I have been informed about this post on the forum and decided to register and take part on it as I am also involved in this.

    My company is called Tootabi Valley Safaris and it is registered with CIPC(Companies and Intellectual Property Commission). Tootabi Hunting Safaris on the other hand cannot be found on this site as a registered company. A search has been done yesterday.

    A lawyers letter have been delivered to Loodt (18 November 2013) We had a meeting afterwards. A decision afterwards to stick to the original decision and the letter to change his name was ignored. A court decision was never made as I was advised it could be a long and very pricy affair. We all know at the end of the day it is only the lawyers that are better off financially once you come out of court. A decision to investigate a little more was then made.

    I then decided to lodge a complain with mr Jaap Pienaar of Nature Conservation and Environmental affairs about his registration as a ph and as a outfitter. He keeps me posted on his investigation. It is still ongoing.

    My concern at the time was that he is my neighbor and that he has met some of my clients in the past. He then invited them on Facebook and contacted them afterwards. He also falsely tags them in his posts. I was then asked if we are in partnership by my clients. That was one of my concerns that his name was to confuse my and/or potential clients.

    My next problem was that if things went south the word Tootabi gets mentioned. That has happened now on this forum where somebody mention Tootabi. Now all this is going to leave a dark mark next to the word Tootabi that represents my business as well.

    I have discussed this matter at the end of 2013 with our PHASA representative. Ferdi has contacted me yesterday and we discussed the matter. He then also made a call to PHASA. I was told that they could not do anything as Loodt is not a member. Ferdi was told the same thing yesterday.I was saddened by that. Why am I a member? We are always being told that we will be protected and that they will protect the industry. We have a PHASA meeting in the Eastern Cape next week. I am going to mention this as a topic for discussion on the meeting. Maybe PHASA can shed some light on the matter. I think we all agree as to get something back for our money, they have stiff subs.

    He is been wished luck for his ph course. He is going to need it. This last weekend he called a Mountain Reedbuck a Common Rhebuck on his facebook page.

    I have hunted professionally for 14 years now. Never did I have a problem with a concession holder or landowner and I made sure every client leaves happy. Now my neighbor does this to me. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

    Everybody that follow this forum should understand that what is said here is to protect the hunting industry and you as a potential client. Keep all above board and sell something that you can deliver and what is true.

    Best regards


    Originally Posted by LeopardsValleySafaris
    I also know that Tootabi Valley Safaris owner Gerrit du Preez (Beans) has sent you a lawyers letter that you are in copyright violation of his registered company , registerd in 2009.
    This letter you have ignored.
     
  20. RogerHeintzman

    RogerHeintzman AH Enthusiast

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    WOW!!! Just happened to visit AH tonight and seen this post. I am a click away from accepting a Lioness and Copper Springbuck hunt with Loodt at Tootabi Hunting Safaris. He offered me a great deal on the Copper Springbuck to finish my slam from my posts on AH. Then I asked him about a lioness and again I got a great deal.

    I am hunting Zim in August for Buff and thought I would add these hunts on my way back. I have my travel agent looking at rescheduling my flights to accommodate these hunts. NOW I am not sure if I should continue with these hunts.

    I will keep a close watch on AH to see what else comes of this situation. I sure do not need the feds breathing down my neck for illegal harvest, transport etc.

    WHAT SHALL I DO?

    "A dream can be relived, again and again in Africa".
     

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