How dangerous is it to hunt a Leopard?

Discussion in 'Hunting Africa' started by Norwegianwoods, Mar 19, 2014.

  1. Gavin Lipjes

    Gavin Lipjes AH Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2010
    Messages:
    103
    Likes Received:
    0
    My Photos:
    13
    Member of:
    Club bleu de Gascon, Gascon Saintongeois, Ariegeois
    Hunted:
    South Africa, Mozambique, Zimbabwe, Namibia, Germany, France, Belgium, Austria, Spain and USA
    Jaco I regret that you possibly interpret my opinion as rude, this is just a forum where hunters can express such. I welcome your, and any, opinion on hound hunting - this is medium for hunting conversation.


    Please note that I comment in my personal capacity and not as the Chairman of the Limpopo hunters liason forum.
     
  2. Jaco Strauss

    Jaco Strauss AH Elite

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Messages:
    1,672
    Likes Received:
    126
    My Photos:
    93
    Member of:
    SCI, PHASA, IPHA
    Hunted:
    South Africa, Zimbabwe, Mozambique, Botswana, Tanzania
    Noted Gavin,
    I guess I misinterpreted character and the weight of a man..... as far as LHLF goes i understand your comment as above, and it is respectfully noted, it just placed a question mark IMO with regards to support from your side to outfitters especially when considering the mess (though improved) that the leopard permitting system has gone through and finds it self in, and then considering that all of these are baited hunts...........You have answered this though.

    I agree constructive conversations on a forum such as this is what makes it so very special.
    :)
    My best always
     
  3. Gavin Lipjes

    Gavin Lipjes AH Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2010
    Messages:
    103
    Likes Received:
    0
    My Photos:
    13
    Member of:
    Club bleu de Gascon, Gascon Saintongeois, Ariegeois
    Hunted:
    South Africa, Mozambique, Zimbabwe, Namibia, Germany, France, Belgium, Austria, Spain and USA
    Jaco I think there is currently a prospective shift (unofficial) in the permitting system for Limpopo that will improve the hunting of Leopard substantially .
    I have no economic interest in any SA hunting and only accepted the tasks of the LHLF in order to make a contribution to true sustainable utilization being realised. I would like my children to know their father not only hunted leopards, but also worked for their conservation.

    I am sure you will attest that your adrenalin surges when following a wounded cat. A bayed up cat that is 1 leap away from clearing the hounds on course to the hunters is just the same, but I am sure you have experienced this ..........
     
  4. Jaco Strauss

    Jaco Strauss AH Elite

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Messages:
    1,672
    Likes Received:
    126
    My Photos:
    93
    Member of:
    SCI, PHASA, IPHA
    Hunted:
    South Africa, Zimbabwe, Mozambique, Botswana, Tanzania
    Gavin same here apart from my interest being split between SA and Moz,

    Our single largest responsibility as hunters is to be pro active in conservation, not by just hunting, but by being pro active throughout the greater industry, whether these include bodies such as LHLF, sustainable conservation education, youth programs or fund raisers/ing

    Most definitely there is no denying that hound hunts could and can be very exciting.

    My best always
     
  5. Safari Afrika

    Safari Afrika AH Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2010
    Messages:
    276
    Likes Received:
    9
    My Photos:
    44
    Member of:
    PHASA - RMEF
    Hunted:
    South Africa - Botswana - Zimbabwe - USA - Namibia
    Jaco and Gavin report to my office for shock collars !!!! :dog:
     
  6. Mtgoat

    Mtgoat AH Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Messages:
    240
    Likes Received:
    0
    Member of:
    SCI, NRA Life Member
    Hunted:
    Namibia, Canada (BC, SK, Nunavut & NWT), US (Alaska, Colorado, Idaho, Nebraska, New Mexico, NY, Ohio, South Dakota, Texas, & Washington)
    This is slightly relevant to this thread. Thought that it might be of interest to some. From the BBC "Why leopard attacks have become election issue in India" BBC News - Why leopard attacks have become election issue in India

    From the article: "We caught one of the leopards which killed two children in three days and sent him to a nearby zoo." Would that be a subterranean zoo with a sod roof that you're talking about?
     
  7. spike.t

    spike.t GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2010
    Messages:
    3,067
    Likes Received:
    167
    My Photos:
    131
    Member of:
    sci int, basc
    Hunted:
    zambia, tanzania, zimbabwe, hungary, france, england
    no but it would probably be better for the leopard, as if they survive the capture some are put in zoos and displayed as maneaters . and the zoos arent that great....
     
  8. Shumba Safaris

    Shumba Safaris AH Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2013
    Messages:
    85
    Likes Received:
    37
    My Photos:
    61
    Member of:
    SA Hunters , Lowveld Hunters , BASA
    Hunted:
    South Africa , Zimbabwe , Botswana , Scotland , France , Belgium , USA
    Jaco , Please read my post again . I say " Wounded Leopard" should not be followed up. I'm willing to walk up to the tree , check for blood and follow for some distance. If he's obviously wounded and made his way and is lying up ahead waiting for me , I'm not following up at night , no matter what the shot placement "could" have been. In my experience , Leopard with well placed shots don't go far if any distance at all.
    Following up potential wounded leopard at night is macho at best , stupid at worst. I've done it , many times , as a younger (stupid) and maybe macho young PH. I rolled the dice and always came up on top. I was the hero. Right ?...
    What I'm saying is that one should be wise , play it by ear , and if its most possibly wounded , leave it till the morning , or use dogs to follow up that night.
    But , to each his own.
    I love hunting out of a blind and outwitting the tom. Hound hunting cannot be dismissed though and is definitely more dangerous than blind hunting. Wouldn't it be a dull world if we all agreed on everything ?

    Happy hunting
     
  9. Hank2211

    Hank2211 GOLD SUPPORTER AH Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2010
    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    36
    My Photos:
    8
    Member of:
    SCI, DU, Pheasants Forever
    Hunted:
    Canada, United States, Zimbabwe, South Africa (Eastern Cape; Northern Cape; North West Province), Cameroon, Argentina
    Matetsi, Zimbabwe, 2010. I shot a good sized tom from about 60 yards just before last light. Fell from the tree like a sack of potatoes. We waited for the truck, got some lights and a shotgun, had a brief discussion about not shooting each other, and then began to walk slowly towards the tree, flashlights on. Pitch black by now. Two Zim PH's (one a friend) - one with a .458, me with a .375 and the other with the 12 gauge semi with 00 buckshot. We expected to see the leopard at the bottom of the tree. Once we could see the base of the tree - about 7 yards away from us - no leopard. I recall saying "what now" and at that instant the leopard came at us from a gully about 10 feet in front of us. Shotgun was emptied - no time for any other shots. Dirt, dust and powder everywhere. The leopard ran into a bush about 12 yards away.

    That led to a discussion about coming back in the morning, but could hear hyenas not far away. I was worried about finding nothing left of my trophy (second attempt at leopard). We discussed leaving the trackers there with a fire for the night, but that didn't seem fair. PH decided to give it one last try - throw something in the bush and see if we can get him out. Some rocks, then a large piece of wood, and out he came, once again at full speed and full roar. This time the shotgun got him, I got him, and the .458 got him.

    Next morning, after the skin came off, we could see that it was shredded by the shotgun. He had also lost an eye - couldn't tell which time. No matter. I have no doubt that if he had gotten one of us, he would have done some serious damage either time. My first shot would have killed him if we'd left him a bit longer - well placed but inadequate penetration from a lousy bullet.

    However you look at it, a seriously wounded cat came at us twice with the strength and more important the will to do us some real damage.

    I would never underestimate a wounded leopard.
     
  10. spike.t

    spike.t GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2010
    Messages:
    3,067
    Likes Received:
    167
    My Photos:
    131
    Member of:
    sci int, basc
    Hunted:
    zambia, tanzania, zimbabwe, hungary, france, england
    now that would be worth seeing :shocked: :laughing:
     
  11. bluey

    bluey GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

    Joined:
    May 21, 2012
    Messages:
    2,863
    Likes Received:
    219
    Location:
    38.12.23south 149.50.37 east
    My Photos:
    50
    Member of:
    ssaa, aba ,bairnsdale field archers
    Hunted:
    australia south africa (limpopo, north west,eastcape) canada (b.c)
    I wouldn't underestimate a wounded or cornered animal of any description ,size,shape or stature .

    but man oh man hank ,
    that leopard hunt of yours would've been exciting ..
    pucker factor= through the roof .
     
  12. Jaco Strauss

    Jaco Strauss AH Elite

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Messages:
    1,672
    Likes Received:
    126
    My Photos:
    93
    Member of:
    SCI, PHASA, IPHA
    Hunted:
    South Africa, Zimbabwe, Mozambique, Botswana, Tanzania
    Hank were you hunting with Darren ellerman? If so I might have met you on that safari?

    My best always
     
  13. Henri van Aswegen

    Henri van Aswegen New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2013
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    South Africa & Mozambique
    Member of:
    SCI, SAHGCA
    Hunted:
    South Africa, Zimbabwe, Botswana, Zambia, Mozambique
    Jaco once again I agree with you. I have hunted a large number leopard both from blind and by day while hunting and stumbling on them. I can honestly say that sitting in a blind has a far bigger adrenaline rush and takes dedication. By sitting in a blind for hours, absolutely still and listening to all the sounds is an experience on it's own. I have assisted numerous professional hunters on these baited hunts and can honestly tell you some of them had difficulty in breathing once the leopard appeared.

    As to the statement that blind and bait hunting has only recently started, I became a professional hunter and outfitter in 1987 and have used this method since. Game habits change due to the hunting methods and demand for each animal. A professional hunter that does not adopt his style of hunting to suit that of the animal and provide his client with the ideal trophy is unprofessional. These hunts are expensive and the client needs the best chance he can get. As for hunting with hounds well each has his preference.

    As to the danger of blinds, I agree it is relatively safe as you say and only gets dangerous once you leave. This does not exclude that a leopard will NEVER climb into a blind. If you make a statement that leopard hunting from a blind is not dangerous then you might as well say buffalo hunting is not dangerous. I have faced charging buffalo, lion and leopard. The leopard after being shot form a blind with no hounds to distract the leopard. Believe me the adrenaline for each of these animals is the same
     
  14. Buff-Buster

    Buff-Buster GOLD SUPPORTER AH Elite

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2011
    Messages:
    1,083
    Likes Received:
    97
    Location:
    Hempstead, Texas
    My Photos:
    78
    Member of:
    Houston Safari Club, Gulf Coast SCI, SCI International. Rowland Ward, NRA, RMEF, Nort American Hunting Club - Life Member, Texas Trophy Hunters
    Hunted:
    Mozambique, South Africa, (Kwa-Zulu Natal & East Cape), Zimbabwe (Charisa & West Nicholson), U.S.(Texas, New Mexico, LA, Mississippi, Oklahoma, Wyoming & Montana), Canada (Alberta) & Argentina (Cordoba)
    Now THATS some funny sh_t Richard!!!!!!!
     
  15. Gavin Lipjes

    Gavin Lipjes AH Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2010
    Messages:
    103
    Likes Received:
    0
    My Photos:
    13
    Member of:
    Club bleu de Gascon, Gascon Saintongeois, Ariegeois
    Hunted:
    South Africa, Mozambique, Zimbabwe, Namibia, Germany, France, Belgium, Austria, Spain and USA
    Hi Henry,

    1987 is considered 'relatively recently' - not even 30 years ago.

    During his Presidency, Roosevelt hunted bear and mountain lion with hounds, so he probably wasn't in the least surprised when, in Africa in 1909, he hunted both lion and leopard with hounds. At that time, hunting the great cats with hounds was the preferred and most accepted technique, and Teddy thought it was "bully".

    Taken from an article : Big Game With Dogs | Hunt Forever

    Again - wounded leopard (like any wounded animal) = dangerous, sitting in a blind = not dangerous. This does not mean it is not an enjoyable or effective method for some, but the intial question was about danger.
     
  16. Norwegianwoods

    Norwegianwoods SILVER SUPPORTER AH Elite

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2011
    Messages:
    1,121
    Likes Received:
    46
    My Photos:
    29
    Hunted:
    Norway, Sweden, England, South Africa
    Your answer mirrors my thoughts about Leopard hunting.

    The way I am assembled, then blind hunting is nothing for me.
    I get crazy by boredom after maximum 2 hours.
    I need to be on my feet and moving to find my prey.
     
  17. Henri van Aswegen

    Henri van Aswegen New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2013
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    South Africa & Mozambique
    Member of:
    SCI, SAHGCA
    Hunted:
    South Africa, Zimbabwe, Botswana, Zambia, Mozambique
    Gavin

    Unfortunately I know of a situation where a leopard tried to climb into a blind. Fortunately it got tangled up in the camo net. It is not likely to happen but can. Further I have had big male leopards on many occasions walk up to the blind and stand there for a couple of minutes les than 5 feet away, (similar to lion). This although not as dangerous as it seems still is quite an experience. Each animal, like humans has his own character and this is where the unpredictability comes in.
     
  18. Jaco Strauss

    Jaco Strauss AH Elite

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2011
    Messages:
    1,672
    Likes Received:
    126
    My Photos:
    93
    Member of:
    SCI, PHASA, IPHA
    Hunted:
    South Africa, Zimbabwe, Mozambique, Botswana, Tanzania
    I am with you Henry, what we seem to forget or neglect in some of the replies are.....
    1.question, is a Leopard dangerous to hunt
    Answer, yes it is... PERIOD. From both blind and over hounds it can be... 75% of all Leopard I hunted with hounds climbed in trees in the khommas as well as Zim., when they are in thick and cornered by hounds it could be dangerous.

    It is worthwhile adding that I am no expert but having co guided around 15 Toms over hounds it should give one a reasonably good idea.

    I specialize in baited hunts.

    2.Do not let blind hunting lull you (by this I mean any prospective leopard hunter) into the idea that these hunts are easy, blind hunting's success rate is way lower on average than hounds, with this being said guides that know what they are doing do have an incredible success rate in the 90's %

    In my experienced opinion, blind hunting is a game of cat and mouse, the skill, Preparation and persistence result, is the reward on baited hunts. Nothing compares to outsmarting a mature Tom.

    To get back to the thread ...again, Quite simply put the danger factor on unwounded buff is not that spectacular either, I have also been charged by buff just while tracking but this was an exception to the rule as well.... the excitement always comes in following up though.

    There is a place for hound hunting... and the modern day industry... 1930's has solidified baited Leopard hunting as the preferred and most used method, and this is not because it is easier... Actually quite the opposite.

    Just wanted to avoid any confusion or mis understanding...

    In closing I do not believe that one can through the board label hounds hunts as being especially more dangerous as Henry I have seen it go both ways on both hunts.

    We should never forget how fortunate we are to hunt these spectacular animals, in all honesty danger has nothing to do with it, it should be on the big 5 and dangerous 7 for obvious reasons especially as it is our second largest predator in Africa.

    My best always
     

Share This Page