First SA hunt, father/son, plains game. Ideas? Suggestions?

[gutterdoc]

Hello all at AH,
Newbie here. I have been reading and looking around for quite some time and now is time for everyone to weigh in. My dad and I are going to SA in 2015. We plan on hunting plains game for 10 days. We have the guns and the gear, but are torn between a couple of outfitters. I cannot find a bad thing about either one of them and therefore I look to the forum for ideas, suggestions, pros, cons, etc. We are not looking for record breaking animals, unless they happen to cross our path. We would like a fine representation of the animal and the story of a good stalk, hunt, shot etc. That means more to us than a 60" Kudu. The time frame for the hunt is late May early June, hopefully to celebrate my father's birthday while we are there. The two outfitters we have looked closer into are: Cruiser Safaris and Wes Hixon's Outdoor Adventures. They are very close in pricing and amenities. One includes VAT, the other not. The list of animals would include a Kudu, Gemsbok, Impala, Warthog, Zebra, Wildebeest, and possibly a Bushbuck or Blesbok.

Cruiser Safaris: 10 Day Hunt 2x1
$5175
Kudu, Gemsbok, Impala, Blue Wildebeest, Warthog, Steenbok or Dukier.

Substitute Blesbok for Steenbok or Dukier ADD $175
Zebra ADD $1175

VAT $378

$5175 + VAT= $5553
Zebra, Blesbok= $1350
GRAND TOTAL= $6903
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wes Hixon's: 10 Day Hunt 2x2
$6250
Kudu, Gemsbok, Impala, Warthog, Zebra, Bushbuck

Blue or Black Wildebeest ADD $850

VAT Included

$6250+ $850 (Wildebeest)=$7100
GRAND TOTAL $7100

I look forward to any and all responses. If someone has comparable pricing on similar packages, please let us know. Just trying to compare apples to apple from reputable PH"s and outfitters.

Thank you

 

[Diamondhitch]

I cant comment on those outfitters specifically but check out the "great deals on hunts" forum and you will find plenty of deals with outfitters, many of whom have multiple positive hunt reports on here in the "hunt reports" forum. Its a great resource.

 

[Blue Skies Hunting Adventures]

I've hunted cruisers 3 times now, in fact just brought my 2 friends over there in September. Can't go wrong and plenty of great animals, of the 14 we took only 1 was not record book as I chose to shoot an older smaller eland and leave the young stud for a future client as record books do not thrill me in any way. I think if you search here you will find a few great hunt reports on cruisers as well. Cruiser Bob is very good at handling all details of your dream hunt. Need anymore info please feel free to call or pm me anytime.

 

[James.Grage]

Hi gutterdoc - Welcome to AH.

I would opt for the mid to late May Slot if it is available.

While the trophy list is doable, some trophy are more difficult than others to get. I am not sure how many bush bucks we turned down as being too small, before getting a chance at one. Kudu the same way if you want to find a double curl 50"+ trophy. I know wart hogs can be difficult to find a true trophy and not take the first that walks by, the big ones do not get that way by being stupid.

Both look programs look good at face value. In my mind, what separates the 2 is the PH services.

Your first package is 2 hunters and 1 PH. With 6 animals each will be a filled program and you want to add a zebra & blesbok to make that 8 animals each. This program will be a stretch unless you take the first that comes along.
Just think about this for a while and think 16 animals in 10 days is that realistic. Doable - Maybe.

Second program is 2 hunters with 2 PH'S. You are looking at 6 animals and plan to add a wildebeest to make that 7 trophy's.
This allow 1 hunter with 1 PH and 10 days to go after 7 animals. Very realistic and doable. and you will have the time to turn down animals and keep hunting.

I have spent the better part of a day just tracking 1 animal only to let it go when we found it. Some days you may get 2 animals, however realistic estimates will put you at 1 animal per day with your PH. Unless you are in a cull operation.

That is my take on it. Being family/friends you will be able to share your day at the camp fire to talk over what you did.

You asked what i would do. So I would elect to take the second package. Do as you wish.

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

Hi gutterdoc,
Welcome to the forum. I have heard good reports about Cruisers. You have certainly come to the right place for answers.
I have sent you a PM.

All the best with your planning.

Take Care,
Marius Goosen

 

[BRICKBURN]

Look at all the other incidental costs as well.
Transfers, Laundry, Alcohol, Extra flights, number of concessions to get your list
Those can add up in time and money.

Have fun planning.

 

[gutterdoc]

Thanks for the responses. I'm looking into a couple of other leads. Most outfitters include pickup/drop off, alcohol, game cooked meals, laundry, etc. Which is better, a package hunt or hunt off a list? I think a package hunt means the landowner has plenty of that species, right? Do they want you to shot the first thing? Been there, done that while hunting mule deer and antelope. Not a good experience. Should I hunt with an outfitter who owns his land and animals or someone who leases the property? If we hunt 2x1 and we near the end of our trip, will the outfitter change it up to 2x2? Is this unheard of? My father will probably never come back to Africa, so I am trying to get the most for him and if I have to sacrifice my hunt, I will. I'm sure I'll be back with my daughters one day once they can steady the rifle.

 

[Bobpuckett]

There are some great outfitters out there. Just to let you know I sent you a PM if there is any way we can help you just let us know.

 

[James.Grage]

Plan on

Thanks for the responses. I'm looking into a couple of other leads. Most outfitters include pickup/drop off, alcohol, game cooked meals, laundry, etc. Many of out PH on here will provide you a great service, and have a package deal that should interest you, contact them.

Which is better, a package hunt or hunt off a list? They both have there plus and negatives. A first time goer should be fine with a package deal as you have not taken any African game . After a safari many will do with daily rates for a PH and individual animals, looking to take different game animals.

I think a package hunt means the landowner has plenty of that species, right? This will depend on the size of ranch you will hunt on. Many times you will hunt different parcels of property. and some operators will be a put and take operation. from what i have seen, some properties will have a surplus of some animals on certain properties and other animals will be difficult to find, that why you may hunt different properties. ask and find out . an example would be a 5,000 acre pasture filled with 800 blesbuck with a few (5) ostriches, a few (15) zebra and may be a few (20) impala, this would be a blesbuck area only.

Do they want you to shot the first thing? Been there, done that while hunting mule deer and antelope. Not a good experience. Hunting 1X1 i have never taken the first animal that was presented (i lied did that on my first safari, taking a great wildebeest, the PH was trying to get him all year) We always tried to get the best representative while in the field. That why some stalks are a bust after getting close enough to get a real good look at your animal. Great fun by the way. Usually you will have time to look over some animals and when you start turning down some just to find one with a 1 or 2 more inches of horns is great exercise and fun to do.

Should I hunt with an outfitter who owns his land and animals or someone who leases the property? I have done both and they can be great.

If we hunt 2x1 and we near the end of our trip, will the outfitter change it up to 2x2? This will be in your contract. Usually the answer is no. However you can ask before booking to see if that option is available. My suggestion is to go 1X1 up front on your safari.

Is this unheard of? My father will probably never come back to Africa, so I am trying to get the most for him and if I have to sacrifice my hunt, I will. I'm sure I'll be back with my daughters one day once they can steady the rifle.

 

[Bos en Dal SAFARIS]

Welcome gutterdoc

You should enjoy your time here on AH.

I am will send you a pm

Kind regards

 

[daved]

As a hunting outfitter that is VAT registered. Foreign currency is zero rated.
I don't charge Vat on foreign currency only local rands.
So just be aware of that
Regards
Dave

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

As a hunting outfitter that is VAT registered. Foreign currency is zero rated.
I don't charge Vat on foreign currency only local rands.
So just be aware of that
Regards
Dave

Dave,
Not quite sure if I understand what you are saying, correctly. I am also VAT registered, and I absorb the VAT. So, in other words, I do not charge VAT on top of my day fees.
But whether you receive foreign currency or Rand, the law is that as a VAT vendor, you must pay VAT to our government on day fees. Not on trophy fees, since the animal will be exported. You do however have to pay VAT to our government on animals where nothing gets exported, or wounded animals.

 

[daved]

Marius
Forex or foreign currency is zero rated.
It's a cash import.
It's like selling lucern, the cash you get has no VAT on.
BUT you can claim Vat on VATable items bought with it.

I don't invoice day rates and game. Etc I invoice the day rate as a package an then game as an extra.

I get audited every VAT return because Of the amount of FOREX I put through my account. No probs.

Contact GB&G auditors in Graaff - Reinet. They do my books as well as Karoo taxidermy that also does tons of Forex.

Barry Burchell was charged by SARS for charging VAT.

Phone me if you need contact details 042 2461388
Cheers
Dave

 

[KMG Hunting Safaris]

Dave,
I will certainly give you a call. The way I do it, is very similar to you. I have a printout from SARS on the requirements on how VAT payable is calculated for Outfitters. According to those requirements, and how I do it, is that I invoice the Day rates, where VAT is payable, and then invoice the animals, where there is no VAT charged. So, the invoice has day rates on them, with VAT payable to SARS, then animals and their prices, where there is no VAT payable, and then the total at the bottom of the invoice, which will then match the deposit value.
I also get audited every VAT period.
But very interested to hear how you do it. Will give you a shout during the week.
Cheers,

 

[archer36]

I am booked with Cruiser Safaris in April. All I can say is the professionalism so far is superb. Communication has been great. They require only a small deposit. Now they offer to hold funds in U.S. for final payment which eliminates the need to carry lots of cash around. Their prices are good too!

 

[Blue Skies Hunting Adventures]

For package hunts at cruisers, I know they pick the species in which they have an abundance of, so they can ensure getting your animals during the said time. When I took my friends I bought them the 8 day package and both were completed by day 5 including both getting kudus in the mountain that were above 53 inches. As I stated before all would reach the sci record book, the ph's themselves take pride in taking exceptional animals and at no time would they ask to shoot the first animal they saw, the reason behind this is they do no advertising and let the clients and trophies do the advertising for them. As far as the end of the trip goes, I could see the entire staff working to ensure all trophies were achieved.

 

[peras]

Welcome Gutterdoc.Cruiser is a good operation.You are at the right site.I have sent you a PM.

 

[joester]

You didn't mention how you & your son feel about hunting inside tall, " game-proof" fenced properties. I've hunted 5x in Africa, my first was on game farm/ranches in Namibia. We shot many animals, but I later learned that some had been bought at faraway auctions and trucked in. All my subsequent hunts were, and will be, on unfenced lands. Zimbabwe, for example, is too costly for many hunters. You can find great unfenced hunts in RSA & Namibia if you look and if that's what you prefer. Crusader Safaris in Rsa is a good one. I have no per$onal affiliation w/them, but I wll be hunting w/them this year. Good hunting to you!

 

[buchnerl]

Gutterdoc, you have come the the right site and the best on the web!

These recommendations that are given here are priceless, in fact I have sent you an "priceless PM" as well! Keep a lookout.

Kind regards,

 

[gutterdoc]

Thanks to all who replied. My father and I have narrowed the list and a final decision is eminent pending travel insurance and some other minor loose ends.

Some offered some very inviting offers and each one was willing to go the extra mile. In the end, I am sure it will be something to remember.