Expected Announcement From U.S. FWS Will Close Elephant Imports From Zimbabwe, Tanzania

Discussion in 'News & Announcements' started by AfricaHunting.com, Apr 4, 2014.

  1. gxsr-sarge

    gxsr-sarge AH Veteran

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    As another example, the ATF (Notice 41P) is proposing a rule that would severely curtail the practical use of gun trusts to legally acquire Class III weapons. Here's a decent article: AMERICAN SILENCER ASSOCIATION STATEMENT ON ATF 41P

    That goodness we support organizations like the NRA and SCI, DSC to name a few....
     
  2. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR GOLD BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    You will not be able to import any parts.

    Would you book something based on the USFWS reviewing the policy in 2015?! :wacky:


    Zimbabwe jumped up trophy fees last year screwing with the outfitters. Now USFWS.

    Hope the guys have good Buffalo areas to fall back on.
     
  3. gxsr-sarge

    gxsr-sarge AH Veteran

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    If the purpose is to protect the elephant population (as is what I gathered by Brickburn's posts), we're in trouble! We may slide by if the rationale is to somehow control poaching and the illegal ivory trade.
     
  4. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR GOLD BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    If you want clarification ask this public relations wizard at USFWS.

    Contacts:
    Gavin Shire
    703-346-9123
    gavin_shire@fws.gov



    It is about the failure to control rampant poaching and the control around same.

    USFWS is "protecting" Elephants in populations "they believe" are at risk.


    The USFWS will review the decision annually.
    Somehow this action will motivate Zimbabwe and Tanzania to miraculously curtail Elephant poaching! :joint:
     
  5. PHOENIX PHIL

    PHOENIX PHIL AH Legend

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    Yeahhhh, like I posted earlier Google "Chinese investment in Tanzania" and substitute Zimbabwe for Tanzania. The Chinese are building a shipping harbor bigger than the one in Dar, makes it easier to ship out that ivory.
     
  6. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR GOLD BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    Given this reactionary decision making I can see why Jacques was suggesting you guys in the US run to RSA to get your Lion today.
    I thought it might be a little alarmist. Given this...... not so much.
     
  7. PeteG

    PeteG AH Enthusiast

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    Just out of curiosity, who would know how many ele licences were issues and how many ele were poached last year in these 2 countries? What would the ratio be as a direct comparison to see the effect of hunting on population as opposed to what poaching is doing to population.
    What has happened in Botswana since the ban on hunting? Have the animal populations improved?
    If anyone has any info on this, it would be interesting to see some numbers.

    The number of licences issued can be controlled which should in effect protect the trophies for the coming years.
    My feeling is that there are a bunch of unscrupulous outfits who would be limited in their activities by this ban, based on this comment
    "Questionable management practices, a lack of effective law enforcement, and weak governance have resulted in uncontrolled poaching and catastrophic population declines in Tanzania. For example, the Selous, Africa's largest protected area, has lost 66 percent of its elephants in the past five years"

    The problem then is that the USFWS is not addressing the fact that saving the ele or lion or rhino or whatever depends on money, without the funds to control poaching, there is not going to be any respite. Hunting in Africa does provide an assistance to anti poaching whether it be cash from the actual hunt or by having people on the ground in the various areas hunting, tracking and scouting, whether they are Wildlife Police Officers or not it is still a deterrent to poaching.

    "In Zimbabwe, available data, though limited, indicate a significant decline in the elephant population, while anecdotal evidence, such as the widely publicized poisoning of 300 elephants last year in Hwange National Park"
    How many of those 300 were hunted?
    How would a ban on trophy hunting have changed the fact that they would still have been poached?
    What has USFWS done to mitigate that action and actions like that which occur on a daily basis?
    Unfortunately for hunters, ban's like these are 'people pleasing' actions that receive a lot of publicity and approval, yet they do very little for the very subject they are trying to 'preserve'.

    The other thing you have to look at is who has done the animal counts and how accurate are they.
    There can be glaring errors in the government counts, such as an area that claims to have 2,000+ Sable but there are no licences issued. I wonder why?
     
  8. Shumba Safaris

    Shumba Safaris AH Senior Member

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    It boggles the mind how a country can be a signatory to CITES , yet decide to make up its own rules concerning imports of certain species , over ruling CITES in the process. If this gets implemented many good people are going to get hurt. I bet there are some outfitters who cannot survive without their Elephant quota.
     
  9. enysse

    enysse AH Ambassador

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    It kinda goes back to bad wildlife management if you look at it from every angle. If the poaching was controlled for lion, rhino and elephants would be having this talk?

    Maybe you still have a growing human population and land encroachment everywhere. Plus a growing public that sees hunting as adding to the problem (and you are never going to talk common sense to them, because they are emotionally deaf).
     
  10. RogerHeintzman

    RogerHeintzman AH Enthusiast

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    Got my lioness booked for this August with Jacques. He has great price on Male lion but still my pocket is not that deep.

    "A dream can be relived, again and again in Africa." (Guess I may have to change my tag line someday).
     
  11. spike.t

    spike.t GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    that is one bet i wouldnt take as its a certainty that this will cause havoc with some of the ph/outfitters especially in zim. as for the fish and wildlife saying they will review it annually, yeah right, once its done it will take some effort and a long time to get a govnt or govnt dept to change it back..........if they decide to make more of their own decisions regarding the import of certain animal species as hunting trophies this could spell a massive decline in the hunting industry and closing/decline/change of use of large areas of african bush and once its gone and most likely cleared for other uses it aint coming back......................what a bunch of f--king muppets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  12. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR GOLD BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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     IF is how this thread started. 
    The SCI warning of the pending announcement came out just before the USFWS made the actual announcement
    The nature or trying to beat press releases in the information age.


    After going to the USFWS website: It is an announcement of policy.
    This is not an IF.


    There is going to be a whole lot of scrambling.

    I'd guess the Outfitters will be coming to the European and Canadian shows to sell Elephant hunts next year.

    Cancellation hunts should start popping up shortly.
     
  13. vette447

    vette447 AH Member

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    I hear you. I have a lion hunt booked for October. I already moved up my plans from hunting in 2015 up to this October due to my fear about an import ban but I am still scared that it will be too late. Or that they will ban importation after I hunt while I am waiting to have my trophy imported. I was so worried about Lion but this elephant thing shocked me. Our Gov is out of control.
     
  14. Royal27

    Royal27 BRONZE SUPPORTER AH Elite

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    This November will be the most important off cycle election in many years. Time to get out and vote. Time to call your congressman. Time to support organizations such as DSC and SCI.
     
  15. efranzoni

    efranzoni New Member

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    :)
    USA organization for fish and wildlife is possible not know what appened in Kenia from closure hunting big game ....... elefants number dropped down strong, because up pouching and idiots strages of elefants fro military on request of villages cheefs that now, without hunt, are no more interested to have elefants on hes territory....
     
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  16. gxsr-sarge

    gxsr-sarge AH Veteran

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    110% Agreed. As a member of both, I expect them to "represent"! Also don't forget about the NRA!
     
  17. gxsr-sarge

    gxsr-sarge AH Veteran

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    How the ban on lion hunting in Botswana killed more lions

    I just found this post while poking around the forum:

    http://www.africahunting.com/huntin.../13049-how-ban-lion-hunting-killed-lions.html

    This guy (and the organization, I think) are "anti's" but I'm impressed that he makes the unbiased conclusion that knowledge is the key - not emotions. It's bit long (14 min) but in a nutshell, he points out the effect of the ban on lion hunting in Botswana in 2000 was that more lion have been killed by cattle farmers than previous levels by hunters due to the encroaching and expanding lion population.

    It's a bit off topic as in this instance, it's the US, not Zimbabwe that are creating the restriction.

    I'm curious what the data are showing regarding the elephant population in Botswana due to the recent ban.
     
  18. sestoppelman

    sestoppelman SILVER SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Well unfortunately if you look at the last major election here, it went very badly for sanity. At least half of the voters are now firmly entrenched in the "take care of ME first" ideology. Thus I am not very optimistic that November will be a whole lot different. Its possible but I think its too late.
     
  19. Warbird782

    Warbird782 AH Veteran

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    Decisions by the US govt like this do not surprise me at all. With the current crooks in charge, I would not be surprised if other uneducated decisions like this get made. The question that I pose to all who read this is.....Do we hunter/conservationists still go and do our part and hunt elephants in Zimbabwe and Tanzania? Should hunters take the high road and do what is right for the species? Without our dollars, the elephants in those countries are not going to be in good shape. I would definitely book a hunt if I could but a true trophy elephant hunt is out of my price range. I plan on hunting a lion or lioness in 2015. If lions get banned from import by then I will still go and experience a lion hunt. I will be disappointed that I will not have the lion in my man cave but the pictures and memories will have to do. If you are from the US and reading this start leaning on your elected officials. Remember the USFWS works for us!
     
  20. Royal27

    Royal27 BRONZE SUPPORTER AH Elite

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    Optimistic or not we can't give up. Besides, a lot can change. The "me first" folks haven't exactly gotten what they wanted over the last six years and I believe we have a chance to reverse direction, but not if we decide "it's too late."
     

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