Blood Lions: Blowing The Lid Off The Canned Hunting Industry

Wow, found this elsewhere on the net:

PHASA PRESIDENT CALLS FOR A REVIEW OF LION HUNTING

Pretoria, 24 July 2015 – Hermann Meyeridricks, president of the Professional Hunters’ Association of South Africa (PHASA), is asking the hunting association to reconsider its position on lion hunting.

In a letter emailed to PHASA members today, Meyeridricks says that the campaign against trophy hunting has intensified around the canned or captive-bred lion hunting issue since its current policy on lion hunting was adopted at its AGM in November 2013.

“We took the view that our position was a stepping-stone to clean up the captive-bred lion hunting industry and made it clear that it was certainly not our final word on the hunting of lions,” he says.

“From my dealings with the media and the community, it has become clear to me that those against the hunting of lions bred in captivity are no longer just a small if vociferous group of animal-rights activists. Broader society is no longer neutral on this question and the tide of public opinion is turning strongly against this form of hunting, however it is termed. Even within our own ranks, as well as in the hunting fraternity as a whole, respected voices are speaking out publicly against it.”

Meyeridricks says that with some airlines and shipping lines refusing to transport hunting trophies, PHASA has to face the fact that the lion issue is putting at risk not only the reputation of professional hunting in South Africa but its very survival.

“PHASA’s current policy on the issue is, broadly speaking, that it recognises the legality of and demand for captive-bred lion hunting, and is working with the predator breeders and government to improve its standards and conditions to a generally acceptable level. We have made little demonstrable progress on this front,” he says.

“Against this background, I have come to believe that, as it stands, our position on lion hunting is no longer tenable. The matter will be on the agenda again for our next annual general meeting and I appeal to you to give it your serious consideration, so that together we can deliver a policy that is defensible in the court of public opinion,” he says in the letter.

For further information contact Hermann Meyeridricks, PHASA president, on 083 303 0498.

Good. As evident in the discussion on this thread, there are at least a few members of this forum who could not agree more strongly.
 
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If they take it to task, It's a fold. Next will be ANY FENCED hunting and that includes ANY size property , any of it cannot be deemed fair chase in the eyes if some of the hunting fraternity.
Give them the inch go ahead, You know what they say......
Some may look at my posts and think , yep he's that way because he has skin in the game.
Contrary , if they stop the hunting of raised lions they won't stop the raising of them as personal property.
The market of meat and bones will continue, mark my word it will.
South Africa Government has decided that these sold bones keep poaching to a minimum keeping pressure off the wild population as these raised ones are easily available and makes he value of poached bones to a minimum.

Quoted from S A government report: From a news story May 1st 2015. The S A Government IS for this !

"The agency says 739 kilograms of lion bones were legally traded to Asia in 2012 as compared to just 55 kilograms the year before."

"The sale of lion products, especially lion bones, offers breeder a way of boosting their earnings. A breeder can get paid anywhere from US$5,000 to US$25,000 per lion shot, but can boost his earnings by selling a lion skeleton, worth between $1,000 and $2,000 to a Chinese dealer in Durban or Johannesburg."

"The Biodiversity Management Plan of S A views a legal trade in lion bones as an economically viable activity and hopes to “promote sustainable legal trade in lions and lion products” using a regulated permit system."

THE BOTTOM LINE HERE, take away the sale of these legal lion bones and your wild lions WILL suffer in the long run. You'll take the hunting away from hunters and you WILL not take away the demand for lion bones. It's not economically feasable to raise lions for just the bones. But it will continue for "tourist baiting" and then sold as skins after they become to old or of no value to the tourist taking pictures by private breeders.

And last but not least...A quote from the 140 page report from Oxford University’s Wildlife Conservation Research Unit (WildCru) July 16th 2015 , if you wish a link to the 140 page report please feel free to send me a PM
I quote in their conclusions of the report......

"Has Lion farming for the hunting industry really taken the pressure off wild Lions? It would currently appear so in South Africa"
I'm done.
 
If they take it to task, It's a fold. Next will be ANY FENCED hunting and that includes ANY size property , any of it cannot be deemed fair chase in the eyes if some of the hunting fraternity.
Give them the inch go ahead, You know what they say......
Some may look at my posts and think , yep he's that way because he has skin in the game.
Contrary , if they stop the hunting of raised lions they won't stop the raising of them as personal property.
The market of meat and bones will continue, mark my word it will.
South Africa Government has decided that these sold bones keep poaching to a minimum keeping pressure off the wild population as these raised ones are easily available and makes he value of poached bones to a minimum.

Quoted from S A government report: From a news story May 1st 2015. The S A Government IS for this !

"The agency says 739 kilograms of lion bones were legally traded to Asia in 2012 as compared to just 55 kilograms the year before."

"The sale of lion products, especially lion bones, offers breeder a way of boosting their earnings. A breeder can get paid anywhere from US$5,000 to US$25,000 per lion shot, but can boost his earnings by selling a lion skeleton, worth between $1,000 and $2,000 to a Chinese dealer in Durban or Johannesburg."

"The Biodiversity Management Plan of S A views a legal trade in lion bones as an economically viable activity and hopes to “promote sustainable legal trade in lions and lion products” using a regulated permit system."

THE BOTTOM LINE HERE, take away the sale of these legal lion bones and your wild lions WILL suffer in the long run. You'll take the hunting away from hunters and you WILL not take away the demand for lion bones. It's not economically feasable to raise lions for just the bones. But it will continue for "tourist baiting" and then sold as skins after they become to old or of no value to the tourist taking pictures by private breeders.

And last but not least...A quote from the 140 page report from Oxford University’s Wildlife Conservation Research Unit (WildCru) July 16th 2015 , if you wish a link to the 140 page report please feel free to send me a PM
I quote in their conclusions of the report......

"Has Lion farming for the hunting industry really taken the pressure off wild Lions? It would currently appear so in South Africa"
I'm done.
Could not agree more with these views.

I have hunted for many years, and been to Africa for about 12 safaris. People know I hunt, and I get questions about hunting in Africa all the time. Not once, and I repeat not once, has anyone ever expressed the view that they would not go to Africa because of the lion hunting issue, if they are even aware of it. In fact, some ask me for details of lion hunting because they want to do it, but can only afford to do it in South Africa.

There are people on both sides of this issue, like there are on almost every issue. Some have an economic incentive to hunt captive raised lions, and others don't. Just as some have an economic incentive to breed color variants and others don't.

I'm going to go with common sense. If people hunt captive raised lions, some, certainly not all, but some, would otherwise have hunted wild lions. Can anyone seriously argue against that?

Equally, I don't see the difference between fenced lion hunting and fenced anything else hunting, so if you think one is wrong, well, it's not long before it's all wrong. And there goes the South African hunting model, successful as it has been in raising and preserving animals.

The real issue in all of this is the one no one will talk about. Habitat loss. What is anyone other than game ranchers doing to preserve habitat for wildlife?
 
Supply has to meet demand, either the Chinese would have to pay a higher price or try to poach wild lions until there were none left, and then they would have to pay for captive raised lions at a high price. People will still be upset the lions are raised to be used as a product rather than set free to live a life dreamed up by Disney.
 
There is something smelly about the quick change of heart and the release of the movie on Wednesday in SA,can't say it's true.
 
The real issue in all of this is the one no one will talk about. Habitat loss. What is anyone other than game ranchers doing to preserve habitat for wildlife?

We are guilty throughout the world of this, but yes no one likes to talk about it because there are no real answer. Money talks.
 
If the circumstance was such that eliminating high fence hunting for lion would ensure the continuation of free range lion hunting, that would be one thing. I could support that. Phrased a little differently, if all the anti's were after was the cessation of high fence lion hunting and would then back off free range lion hunting, I would probably view that as an acceptable concession. That is not the case and is never going to happen. Giving in on the high fence lion issue is the death nell for ALL lion hunting, period. As has been pointed out quite well already, where does it go from there? Very slippery slope...
I guess I'm on the "buckling" side of the high fence when it comes to PHASA.
 
If they take it to task, It's a fold. Next will be ANY FENCED hunting and that includes ANY size property , any of it cannot be deemed fair chase in the eyes if some of the hunting fraternity.
Give them the inch go ahead, You know what they say......
Some may look at my posts and think , yep he's that way because he has skin in the game.
Contrary , if they stop the hunting of raised lions they won't stop the raising of them as personal property.
The market of meat and bones will continue, mark my word it will.
South Africa Government has decided that these sold bones keep poaching to a minimum keeping pressure off the wild population as these raised ones are easily available and makes he value of poached bones to a minimum.

Quoted from S A government report: From a news story May 1st 2015. The S A Government IS for this !

"The agency says 739 kilograms of lion bones were legally traded to Asia in 2012 as compared to just 55 kilograms the year before."

"The sale of lion products, especially lion bones, offers breeder a way of boosting their earnings. A breeder can get paid anywhere from US$5,000 to US$25,000 per lion shot, but can boost his earnings by selling a lion skeleton, worth between $1,000 and $2,000 to a Chinese dealer in Durban or Johannesburg."

"The Biodiversity Management Plan of S A views a legal trade in lion bones as an economically viable activity and hopes to “promote sustainable legal trade in lions and lion products” using a regulated permit system."

THE BOTTOM LINE HERE, take away the sale of these legal lion bones and your wild lions WILL suffer in the long run. You'll take the hunting away from hunters and you WILL not take away the demand for lion bones. It's not economically feasable to raise lions for just the bones. But it will continue for "tourist baiting" and then sold as skins after they become to old or of no value to the tourist taking pictures by private breeders.

And last but not least...A quote from the 140 page report from Oxford University’s Wildlife Conservation Research Unit (WildCru) July 16th 2015 , if you wish a link to the 140 page report please feel free to send me a PM
I quote in their conclusions of the report......

"Has Lion farming for the hunting industry really taken the pressure off wild Lions? It would currently appear so in South Africa"
I'm done.

Well, @Vevew and @african lion, did you see this?

Has not the argument been made to make the trade in rhino horn legal which would prompt the farming of rhinos and thus take the pressure off of wild rhino?


@The Artistry of Wildlife, would you please just paste the link into a reply on this thread? I'd like this one to be made immediately available to all who may in the future see this thread.
 
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I really cant believe some think the anti's would not just be after something else if not this. This is what they pick because they see us fighting with each other as hunters. You dont see the guys for raised lion hunting going after stopping wild lion hunting or any form of hunting.

We give in there will be a next animal they want to save they will not say oh they gave in lets move on and let them alone now. It will make them feel like they final won something and make them try even harder.Next will be ele,wild lion or leopard. Then it will be from the same guys putting down raised lion hunting saying we must all stick together to stop them. At that point I will just laugh and say I told you so.More will come and saying this issue was the start of it is kidding yourself and not helping any hunter. I do believe anti hunters were around well before the first raised lion was hunted. The times we live in has just made them more willing to do what they think is right and as we get fewer we fight more just worrying about what makes each one of us happy instead of what is right as a group.We give them one inch they are going to take a mile and run with it.
 
The more I read it the better it gets to me anyway

Here is another quote on the recommendations

"Since it seems unlikely that the trade in Lion bones will be banned in South Africa in the near future, or that syndicates, traders and Southeast Asian consumers will cease consumptive practices involving Lions and Tigers, the pragmatic blanket recommendation is that measures currently in place to impede opportunities for illegal activities are strengthened across the entire supply chain from Lion breeding to skeleton exports."

Not to stop it at all.....get more control of it cause lion bone consumption aint going away.


I'm attaching the file. this pertains to lion hunting and the bone trade of them.
 

Attachments

  • traffic_species_mammals83.pdf
    4.5 MB · Views: 967
PHASA You cannot, and will not convince any liberal minded protesting anti-hunter that ANY HUNTING can be justified. Your appeasement of this will be nothing but gas on an ember. Everything I read I can find is the S A government does not have this on it's agenda in the near future or is very concerned about it.
 
Some (many?) have been saying for years that the best hope for the rhino is legalized trade in horns. If that were to happen, there is little doubt that the number of rhino raised privately would go up and, with some work, the poaching of wild animals would go down.

Instead, we get more of what is demonstrably not working. Ban it, and you increase the value and this leads to increased supply. Is it sarcastic to say that banning trade in rhino and elephant parts has been such a success that we should extend the same favor to lions?

If the raising of captive lions is banned, what makes anyone think that the result will be different? We have been unsuccessful at changing behaviour with respect to ivory and rhino horns.

If you do the same with lions, I can, I think, safely predict that not only will we see the same result, but it will be worse. This is an animal which, outside of a park, no rural African wants. Increase the value of a lion skeleton by banning the trade, and you will not have a wild lion left outside of a park.

To what end?
 
Unless we humans do something about population growth, there won't be room for domestic, bred, or wild animals anywhere. So, the discussion will be moot. Personally, I believe that if the parameters of the hunt are as Dennis and Eric have described, all of us as hunters, should support it.


worldpopulat.gif
 
thi9eisp You get that Tarh moving from New Zealand yet? Damaske is waiting...
 
First screening and now the reviews start,spells some trouble for many folks,but also for wild lions.
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I wonder if the packed house of 10 people really liked the popcorn they served with the one sided story.
 
Bill,PHASA chairman and Adri Kristoff were there too,so were a few big wigs in the SA hunting industry. No doubt why PHASA is relooking their stand on this. This documentary is going to be a global blow to us,like it don't like it but it is going to change the way things are done. In the end it will be the wild lion that will suffer,the demand for lion bone won't stop. Neither will the hunting of the big cats,more loop holes will be found by those that seek money more than the chase.
 

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