Beware of Cull or Management Hunts in Namibia

Discussion in 'Hunting Africa' started by AfricaHunting.com, Apr 22, 2010.

  1. AfricaHunting.com

    AfricaHunting.com FOUNDER AH Ambassador

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    I have been noticing a disturbing trend from outfitters in Namibia. I have come across a dozen or so websites of Namibian hunting outfitters and hunting consultants who are offering cull or management hunts in Namibia to hunting clients which is illegal.

    I just put it out there to make hunters aware who may be interested in these types of inexpensive and action packed hunts that they may unknowingly be participating in a hunt that is illegal. I suspect that most hunting consultants who are offering these hunts are unaware of the Namibian regulation on this subject however there are no excuses for Namibian outfitters who are offering these illegal hunts to foreign hunters who don't know any better.

    It is legal for a hunting client in Namibia to shoot old, setback or abnormal trophies however Namibian outfitters are offering cull or management hunts in their country with sometimes up to 24 trophy and non-trophy animals of one species while the law dictates that a hunting client may only take two animals of a each species each year, irrespective if the trophies are exported or not.

    Also it should be noted that any trophies or non-trophy animals that are not exported from Namibia or wounded game not recovered are subject to a government tax of 15% (VAT) based upon the trophy fee paid by the hunting client.

    Basically a hunting client would not be able to export more than two trophies from the same species and would be liable to pay the additional tax due on any of the other trophies left behind.

    Just by the way these types of hunts are being presented and marketed I can tell that these Namibian outfitters offering these cull or management hunts are clearly trying to get around the rules. It seems to me that these outfitters are trying to bypass the law by offering these hunts as a package hunt without defining trophy fees. This may be a grey area however by doing these hunts, hunting clients and outfitters are crossing the line of the law in other ways that are clearly illegal.

    I have contacted NAPHA for some clarification as to some of the grey areas, however as a hunting client I would be very wary of participating in any hunt in Namibia that was marketed as a cull or management hunt for more than 2 animals of the same species.
     
  2. AfricaHunting.com

    AfricaHunting.com FOUNDER AH Ambassador

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    Attached are some websites' image screenshots of cull or management hunts in Namibia offered by both Namibian hunting outfitters and hunting consultants.
     

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  3. enysse

    enysse AH Ambassador

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    I have seen these hunts for a long time! I didn't know about the VAT tax on animals not exported. My guess is the bill, the client pays, is different than...maybe the legal way. Either the trophy fees are written very low or the animals are shot and not reported (so no VAT is paid). Interesting article. I know most operators love that that someone will pay to cull animals....it's great business.
     
  4. Karl Stumpfe

    Karl Stumpfe AH Veteran

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    Hi Jerome

    It can be done legally, as follows:
    1) During the meat hunting season, a hunter can hunt more than the stipulated 2 trophy animals, as meat animals, on a seperate meat hunting permit. (Certain conditions apply to numbers and where and when it may be hunted, only 2 trophies can be exported however if shot on a seperate trophy permit.)
    2) If the land owner holds a shoot and sell permit for surplus game, he is open to sell that game to whovere he sees fit (once again, whovever shoots the animals, can only export 2 trophies per species.)
    3) We get a "traditional use" quota on animals like elephant, buffalo and hippo (also on some plains game) where the hunt may be sold for the hunt alone, the animal is shot for meat/ traditional feasts and the trophy belongs to the concervancy, in other words, it normally cannot be taken by the client.

    All of the above presumes that the hunter are accompanied by a qualified and registered PH/ HG for the level of game he / she wants to hunt, and that a proper trophy/ meat/ shoot and sell/ traditional use permit is issued.
     
  5. Andries

    Andries AH Member

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    Karl, legaly there are only 2 ways of culling animals on your property.

    1. By a shoot and sell permit. This alow only the farm owner or his manager to shoot animals during the day. Not by an appointed person.
    2. By a culling permit. This has to be done by a registered night culling team.

    The law states that a foreigner is only allowed to hunt two (2) animals per species.

    The meat hunting permit "thing" is a GREY area in the law.

    With that you can hunt 12 small game or 4 big game of the following species - Kudu, gemsbuck, Hartebeest (big game) and warthog, springbuck (small game). This was meant for Namibians and South Africans.

    There are so many things going on in the hunting industry in Namibia, that nobody know what is wrong or right. This is not the job of NAPHA or anybody to control it, but MET.

    Forgeiners can only hunt two (2) animals per species. If they hunt with a bow AND a gun they can shoot only two in total.

    I think that if you got good outfitter he will try to stay in the law and not looking of ways to bypass it.
     
  6. AfricaHunting.com

    AfricaHunting.com FOUNDER AH Ambassador

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    Karl and Andries, Thank you both for your input.

    First let me point out that NAPHA's website contains the following information:

    Trophies
    A hunting guest may only take two animals of a kind each year, irrespective if the trophies are exported or not.
    All Trophies must attain the minimum points of trophy quality.
    (Exceptions are allowed only with old, setback or very abnormal trophies.)


    Screenshot of NAPHA's website
    [​IMG]

    Personally I could not agree more with Andries' information, and I would even go further to say that a wounded game not recovered is not only taxed the VAT but also counts as one animal towards the two animals that a hunting client is permitted to take per species each year.

    Karl, There might definitely be some question as to the interpretation of the law regarding the "meat hunting permit" however, can you please explain to me how this law could supersede the fact that from a simple aspect a hunting client may only take two animals of each species each year, irrespective if the trophies are exported or not.

    Do you know when is the legal meat hunting season? I have not seen anyone offering these cull / management hunts mentioning anything about the meat hunting season.

    When you say a "hunter" in your first point are you referring also to foreign hunting clients who are paying to hunt or are you referring to hunters who are getting paid to do a job?

    How is the government tax handled if indeed a foreign hunting client is able to shoot more than two (2) animals under a "meat hunting permit"?

    I agree with your point number 3, as I mentioned in my first post it is legal for a hunting client in Namibia to shoot old, setback or abnormal trophies, cull animals as long as they keep to the limit of two animals of each species each year.
     

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  7. Dinsdale

    Dinsdale AH Senior Member

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    Interesting thread...don't know if I would post other companies web-sites unless given a chance to respond.

    I recognize most of them.

    But the farm with the sliding scale for shot placement?

    Sign me up!
     
  8. AfricaHunting.com

    AfricaHunting.com FOUNDER AH Ambassador

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    Dinsdale, You might recognize them though I have not included any links and it was not to single out anyone in particular...

    I also thought "what the heck with this! :eek:" regarding the shot placement payment system. Not only that but their scale payment in relationship to the area makes no sense what so ever...

    [​IMG]
     
  9. Karl Stumpfe

    Karl Stumpfe AH Veteran

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    A shoot and sell permit can be used to shoot animals by an appointed person, (may be a grey area), as when we used to cull, day or night, you can be appointed as culling team on such permit. You can also join a culling team without going through the very stringent test (I do not know what it comprises of now, but in the 1990's you have to shoot 20 springbok with 23 bullets if I remember correctly) as a temporary member, even on night shoots. I would be very hesitant to sell such "hunts" though, as there is 100's of ways to interpet the laws.
     
  10. Andries

    Andries AH Member

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    Do you realy want to do all this BS. just to shoot 5 Springbuck more?
     
  11. AfricaHunting.com

    AfricaHunting.com FOUNDER AH Ambassador

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    I do think that this type of hunts combined with some trophy hunting is appealing to some clients, I don't think that there is a huge market for it, but if priced properly, clients could get a kick out of it!

    I have no objection with offering and selling these cull / management hunts, to the contrary, I'm just trying to understand whether it is actually something that can be marketed and offered to hunting clients without breaking the "law". Every time that I try to rap my head around I come up with another reason why it is questionable!

    I'm waiting to get some clarification from NAPHA.
     
  12. Dinsdale

    Dinsdale AH Senior Member

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    I thought it made sense in that shoot in the ass and wreck more meat.....pay more.

    In terms of the whole deal here? I really don't see what the big deal is. If a private farmer wants to make a few extra bucks off animals he needs to thin anyway; who cares?

    It's not like the state owns the stock correct?

    I wouldn't say the same for gov't type concessions,but for private land where carrying capacity dictates eliminating animals on a regular basis, what is the difference who pulls the trigger?

    The meats getting sold one way or another.

    I have done cull SHOOTING in the US on damage control whitetails and cull hunting in Africa; where you hunt particular lesser animals same as you would trophy ones. Had a good time on the hunts; the shooting is just hitting target,good for shooting skills I guess.

    Someone here is asking for a reference for a outfitter you posted a page from;interesting to see what he thinks about this as I donot know how that hunt is conducted.
     
  13. AfricaHunting.com

    AfricaHunting.com FOUNDER AH Ambassador

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    Dinsdale,

    I get the scale payment system based on the meat aspect of things, what I don't get is that they define the area however the price is the same from a Springbok, Gemsbok to an Eland. Also wounded game is to be paid full price, so you are being charged the regular trophy fee while you are shooting cull non trophy, female and young animals... personally it makes no sense.

    On an open or low fenced private property the game is "owned" by the land owner as long as the game is on his land however it does not mean that the owner has the encumbered rights over it or can just kill large number of game on his land at any given moment. Some species will be fully protected and some might be subject to hunting quotas and /or special hunting permits. Many of these laws are there to regulate and protect against over harvesting as some of these animals migrate through many properties over vast areas. Good rules make for good neighbors, and this is one of those areas where this is very true. It is true that today in Namibia there are many more high fenced properties than there used to be but the rules are there for every land owner. These rules are very important for maintaining good game populations especially in areas that are open. The land owner will have to apply for a cull / management / meat hunt permit stipulating exactly what he wants to harvest as far as species and numbers and the Namibian government will grant the property owner what they estimate to be appropriate.

    There has been abuse with the "few extra buck" principale and when it is your neighbor it is not something you take lightly especially when you try to implement a strict game management program and all of your efforts are not only taken away, but also for the profit of someone else, in this case your neighbor.

    I agree with you, on these types of hunts it does not really matter who pulls the trigger as long as they can shoot properly and get the job done efficiently.

    I would also like to see what duckman90 thinks after reading this thread.
     
  14. Corne Kruger

    Corne Kruger New Member

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    If you have a high fenced ranch and you get a shoot and sell permit it is legal to sell cull hunts!!!! The game inside our high fence is OUR property and we can do with them what we like....
     
  15. Corne Kruger

    Corne Kruger New Member

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    Jerome, we sell cull hunts because our ranches get over populated and we have to shoot or catch the animals. We do get the permits to shoot and sell the animals and nowhere on the permit is says who is allowed to take these animals.
    We do not over exploit any species or just shoot young and pregnant females, we do selection hunting and that is why we produce some of the best trophies in Namibia.
    This is a good way of getting your numbers down....
     
  16. Code4

    Code4 AH Enthusiast

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    I have only been to Africa twice on paid hunts but have always included cull animals on my list. This type of hunt appeals greatly as it allows me the chance to spread my hard earnt dollars furthur and to take a wider variety of animals.

    Trophys don't interest me but the opportunity to hunt and also shoot larger animals than are available to me at home is a bonus. If these animals are surplus to trophy requirements for rich Americans and the like and are only consuming resources, why not get someone to pay to do it rather than expend time, money and resources to manage those resources yourself.
     
  17. AfricaHunting.com

    AfricaHunting.com FOUNDER AH Ambassador

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    I would have to disagree with your statement, it is not because it is on someone's property that the owner gets to do with it what he wants.
     
  18. Corne Kruger

    Corne Kruger New Member

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    Jerome,

    Go look at our constitution. In a high fenced property I can shoot all my animals if I want to because they belong to me!!!! If I apply for a permit to shoot all my Gemsbuck today I will get the permit, they can not refuse me a permit.

    On non high fenced areas you are correct you can not shoot animals like you like, you need permits and your farm need to be inspected to qualify for a quota.
     
  19. AfricaHunting.com

    AfricaHunting.com FOUNDER AH Ambassador

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    Well I define game as any animal hunted for food or hunted for "sport".

    Namibian legislation lists Leopard and Cheetah as Specially Protected under the Nature Conservation Ordinance (Ordinance 4 of 1975) and as such no person may hunt a Leopard or Cheetah without a permit. Nonetheless, owners or occupiers of land may kill Leopards or Cheetahs in defense of human life or to protect the life of livestock. When this happens, it is compulsory to report such killing to the Ministry of Environment and Tourism within 10 days, at which point a tag number is allocated to the skin of such an animal. Once again it is not because it is on someone's property that the owner gets to do with it what he wants. Yes in practice, the stricture that Leopard or Cheetahs may only be hunted to protect human life or while actually threatening livestock has been ignored. Many landowners believe that they can just kill Leopards and Cheetahs from their land on a precautionary principle, viewing them as a potential threat to life or livestock. As of yet I do not believe that the Ministry of Environment and Tourism (MET) has challenged the land owners right to do so and does not strictly enforce the law’s provision that land owners report the killing of Cheetahs and Leopards within ten days and in practice, of course, it is difficult to imagine how the government would ever be able to do this.
     
  20. Dinsdale

    Dinsdale AH Senior Member

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    What does Mr.Kruger's example of gemsbok have to do with the hunting special protected animals?

    And why cherry pick his quotes? Such as ignoring that he stated that a permit does not included information on who the shooter is?(re post #15) Just one needs to be obtained? Or is this a "gray" area.
     

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