Anyone else tired of poor shooting and dumb hunters on TV progams

Discussion in 'Before & After the Hunt' started by Cliffy, May 30, 2012.

  1. Cliffy

    Cliffy AH Elite

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2009
    Messages:
    1,062
    Likes Received:
    2
    My Photos:
    7
    Hunted:
    Hunted Zim, RSA (2), Namib(2), going again, Calif, Oregon, Arizona, Texas, Virginia, Idaho, South Dakota, Montana, Nevada, MO
    While I watch several hunting programs on TV (mostly African) I'm sure tired of watching dumb hunters shooting one time and not reloading or poor shots getting their back slapped by the PH on how good they did. Anyone else getting tired of it?
  2. saeng101

    saeng101 AH Veteran

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2011
    Messages:
    234
    Likes Received:
    0
    My Photos:
    4
    Member of:
    KZN Hunting & Conservation, CHASA, NRA
    Hunted:
    USA,Zim,RSA,Russia,Moz
    It is joke watching the poor shooting. Actually had a famer tell me that anyone from the US can't shoot and wanted R200 for a missed shot. Sounds like brag but picked up 6 critteres wounded by Afrikaaners, he was my bud after this. Can't understand why anyone pays to go to Africa and won't put in the range time.

  3. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR GOLD BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2010
    Messages:
    6,913
    Likes Received:
    71
    My Photos:
    396
    Member of:
    KZN Hunters Assoc
    Hunted:
    Namibia, South Africa, Botswana, Canada, USA, Mexico
    It is disturbing to watch poor shot placement at any time, including my own mistakes.

    That PH's livelihood depends on those back slaps and getting that hunter over that poor shot as fast as he can to get on with the hunt on that all to short hunting trip.

    It's TV and it does get tiring.
  4. Norwegianwoods

    Norwegianwoods SILVER SUPPORTER AH Elite

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2011
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    23
    My Photos:
    29
    Hunted:
    Norway, Sweden, England, South Africa
    I am very much tired of and provoked by it.

    I very clearly told my PH last year if he back slapped me and said my shooting was good when I made a bad shot, I would take it as a personal insult.

    I have met some hunters from many different countries. Included from US, SA and Scandinavia that think wounding an animal is not a big deal.
    It seems to be that it is something that happens rather often and nothing to care much about.

    Wounding an animal while hunting do happen, but it should be very rare and it is for sure in my opinion a very big deal.
    I practice and prepare as much as I can to avoid it to happen and I think all hunters have the obligation to do the same.

    To many of the TV hunting shows and hunting DVDs make it look like crap shooting and wounding animals is a common thing and nothing to make to a big deal about.
  5. James.Grage

    James.Grage GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2010
    Messages:
    2,452
    Likes Received:
    15
    My Photos:
    59
    Member of:
    NRA, ATA, PITA, NAHC, NAFC, DU, TU, DSC, SCI, RMEF
    Hunted:
    USA - Canada -Tanzania, South Africa, Zimbabwe, Africa
    AS mentioned many times, here and on other forums.

    There are many who go hunting that have difficulty making a 20 to 30 yard shot.:(

    We have all seen videos of hunters wounding Big 5 Dangerous game and plains game at close yardages. Even missing when with in 25 yards using a rest.

    WE have had forum Post on AH when should PH'S step in to help make the finishing shots and when to let the hunter make the final shots...

    I know PH make a few bucks selling videos of wounded Game being tracked an some times charging. All this while the PH are trying to get there client into what they feel is a high percentage shot.:)

    I have been in contact with a few PH over the last few years and here is one for you that fall right in line with this forum topic.

    May this year, A person was leopard hunting and a blind was set up 35 yards form the bait animal. The hunter was shooting a Mauser in 300 win mag using 180 grain bullets. This was the second safari of the year for this hunter as he was on an extended safari in multiple African countries. Well the short of the story is the leopard was wounded and the follow up was call off after sundown to be renewed the next morning. Well the hyenas were the finders of the leopard and the hunter was out his leopard.

    Also May of this year, a Hunter shooting a 458 Win Mag was able to stalk to with in 50 to 60 yards of a cape buffalo and had a broad side shot at an standing animal. The stick were set and the hunter placed his rifle in and was given the green light to take his time and shoot when ready. Well the hunter was able to would the cape buffalo bull in the rear right foot. The animal was hit in one of his toe nails. The PH was able to make a follow up shot on the Cape buffalo and bring it down.

    These stories are out there from all the PH's so it is not a one time deal. I know posters on here ruffle there neck hairs when talking about Mark Sullivan and the wounded cape buffalo s charges. Well Mark have some of the best trackers around and Mark like to let the hunter make there kill. In talking to him he back up only when needed. A story he related to me was a wealthy client came on a 21 day safari in Tanzania with 21 bullets. A bullet for each day of the safari as he considered him self a good shot. By day 4 of the safari the client was out of ammunition and had not killed or hit a animal.
  6. Hank2211

    Hank2211 GOLD SUPPORTER AH Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2010
    Messages:
    106
    Likes Received:
    4
    My Photos:
    8
    Member of:
    SCI, DU, Pheasants Forever
    Hunted:
    Canada, United States, Zimbabwe, South Africa, Cameroon, Argentina
    Gents, I dont' think this issue is necessarily as straight-forward as it is being made to appear. Firstly, let me say that I agree that far too many people show up in Africa without having trained enough or even being familiar with the very manly rifle they bought just for the trip. No excuse for that.

    Having said that, I can tell you from personal experience that shooting from a rest on a range and shooting at a very big and potentially dangerous animal are two very different things. Very few of us are lucky enough to have a great deal of experience at shooting elephant for example. I can tell you that while I think I'm a reasonable shot, and I try for a one-shot kill every time, when faced with my one and so far only elephant at 12 yards, I messed up the side brain shot. How can you miss a house at 12 yards?. Adrenalin and nerves can save your life, but they can also ruin your shot. Now, I had told my PH in advance that I wanted to try the side brain shot - less margin for error of course than a heart lung shot - and asked him to immediately back me up if the shot failed. In the event he did, and my second shot put the elephant down before he'd had a chance to move three yards, but the fact remains that I, like many of us, was impacted by a lack of experience - not in firing my rifle, but in firing my rifle at elephants.

    If I compare shooting my first bear with my most recent bear, I know I am calmer and a better shot in the field. So it goes.

    So let's distinguish between the two situations. If you can say that you've never missed, or never wounded and animal, I'd say you likely haven't hunted very much or you're really a fisherman at heart (that is, you have a hard time with the truth!). I, for one, am grateful when some tv shows actually present the missed shot. If you watched some shows you'd think that no one ever misses in Africa, or otherwise messes up a shot. It's how you deal with those situations that matters, or that should matter.

    Now, as for the slap on the back by the PH. There is a line between congratulating someone on a bad shot and doing what you can to help someone get over a bad shot. The first is a bad idea, while the second is a good idea. A good PH will help you become a better hunter and a better shot while maintaining his integrity and ensuring that the hunt is an enjoyable experience.

    Just my two cents.
  7. Diamondhitch

    Diamondhitch AH Legend

    Joined:
    May 2, 2011
    Messages:
    2,325
    Likes Received:
    7
    My Photos:
    67
    Member of:
    SCI
    Hunted:
    Canada (AB, SK, NWT, BC) USA (NM, TX) South Africa (Limpopo, KZN, Free State, Eastern Cape, Northen Cape), Kyrgyzstan
    LOL those are by far the most disturbing.

    As far as making poor shots I can not speak down to anyone. After honing my shooting skills at the range and on NA game animals over the years my record is impressive. However in Africa I have shot like a little B!tch! I get buck fever (I have only experienced this once at home on a huge Bighorn many many years ago). I find myself having to calm my nervs and even when I squeeze off what felt like a perfect shot I was suprised at where I actually hit. I would say I am only proud of 4 of the 14 1st shots taken on this last safari. The couplequickly fired follow up shots that were required were far more controled and prevented us from having to follow up on any wounded game as well as luck playing a part in allowing the most stray shots to stay in the lungs despite not hitting the spot where I aimed. To say I struggled with my shooting this year would be an understatement yet each time I went to the range I fired tight little groups right where they should be. No sense beating yourself up over it, next time will be better, that is a promise I have made to myself.
  8. Stretch

    Stretch AH Fanatic

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2012
    Messages:
    618
    Likes Received:
    0
    My Photos:
    15
    Hunted:
    USA , Canada, Botswana
    I don't have a problem with video's or TV show showing hunters missing or wounding animals. This is real, no one is perfect. Yes, there are some that do not prepare well, but far and away I would say most errant shots are causing by what is called "buck fever." Novice and experienced hunters both can and do experience this phenomenon. Basically it can be described as nervous excitement causing one to lose the ability to concentrate or perform at the same practiced level. Experience and repetition can help one control the sensation but in many (including myself) it is never cured. Seems the more I want something, the harder it is to concentrate. One of the tricks that has helped me is to talk to myself. If I am guiding someone I whisper instructions calming the hunter. Many have told me this has helped them calm down allowing for a good clean shot. Just don't talk out-loud or you may get a funny look from your PH.
  9. Cliffy

    Cliffy AH Elite

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2009
    Messages:
    1,062
    Likes Received:
    2
    My Photos:
    7
    Hunted:
    Hunted Zim, RSA (2), Namib(2), going again, Calif, Oregon, Arizona, Texas, Virginia, Idaho, South Dakota, Montana, Nevada, MO
    Maybe a clarification is in order from me. I'm not trying to indicate that I/you/anyone can't miss on a shot. It happens BUT it is between us and our PH and NOT broadcast all over the country and maybe the world for every gun hater and hunting hater to view. It happens, it's real life but we should do all we can to put the best face forward (on TV at least) of hunting and good hunting ethics. We have enough to overcome just by doing what we do rather than inflame the masses. In addition, I call notice to the quality of many of the shows. Very low quality on video, sound, framing, not the least of which is the "staring" of very 2 bit CEO in the industry trying to be the big star on his own advertisement. I've seen guys with brand new doubles (expensive doubles) that didn't even know which barrel each trigger fired! We've all seen 'hunters" that can't get on target in 30 seconds of film. I can recall one lion hunt where 2 were in sight at about 70 yds and BOTH PHs were urging the shooter to fire. Shoot, shoot, shoot shoot, is all you heard in the background and he didn't fire. So again, why do we suffer through this poor display and broadcast it around the world? Is it just so vanity can triumph and one can be seen on TV as the big Bawana? It looks to me like many of them are strictly ego driven with no thought to quality. I know I can produce a better show and I'm sure many of you can also.
  10. Diamondhitch

    Diamondhitch AH Legend

    Joined:
    May 2, 2011
    Messages:
    2,325
    Likes Received:
    7
    My Photos:
    67
    Member of:
    SCI
    Hunted:
    Canada (AB, SK, NWT, BC) USA (NM, TX) South Africa (Limpopo, KZN, Free State, Eastern Cape, Northen Cape), Kyrgyzstan
    Misses should not be something we tolerate in ourselves. When we accept them as 'part of the hunt' we lower ourselves to the lowest common denominator. Whenever I pull the trigger, with a couple notable exceptions which I am not proud of, I know 100% that my bullet will find its mark. Being human sometimes our bullet will not find its mark despite this confidence but if it happens on a regular basis something is very wrong.

    I do not have satelite tv and as such cannot comment on the missing/wounding situation on tv shows but if it is anything more than occasional and portrayed as a punch in the stomach of the shooter then it has no place there IMO. Ethics must be #1, Misses can and do happen so the odd one would not bother me accompanied by the right attitude towards them.
  11. RickB

    RickB AH Fanatic

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2011
    Messages:
    866
    Likes Received:
    2
    My Photos:
    11
    Member of:
    NRA lifetime, SCI Member, Longhunters LLC
    Hunted:
    South Africa, Germany, USA (OH, NY, VA, PA)
    As we all know we are human. (most of us anyway). We do our best as hunters to make clean, one shot kills. Every now and then it just doesn't work. It has happened to me twice. IT SUCKS! But one pulls it together and goes at it again tomorrow. What gets to me on these shows is like Cliffy said. You see the shot and it sucks. You can't miss it. It clear as day in the video. It looks like high noon on the shot yet the post hunt video is at night. This bothers me. I know they show the occasional arrow hitting a barb wire fence and missing the deer. Yeah that sucks. But what looks to be a clear liver shot and nothing is said. This I have seen on shows before and it bothers me.
  12. sestoppelman

    sestoppelman SILVER SUPPORTER AH Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2010
    Messages:
    2,346
    Likes Received:
    8
    My Photos:
    68
    Member of:
    NRA, NA Hunt Club
    Hunted:
    Tanzania, Botswana, Zimbabwe (2), Namibia, South Africa (2)
    We are human, we do make mistakes. All of us would like to make one shot kills every time, aint gonna happen. When someone tells me he never misses, I know he either is a liar or has never fired a shot in anger. The more game animals we shoot at the higher the likelyhood that something will go amiss. As to always knowing where our bullet will go? Dont forget that little thing called trees, twigs and brush which can and will send ones bullet off into the toolies. It has happened to me at least 3 verifiable times when the setup looked perfect. We do the best we can and get on with it and try to learn from mistakes that are correctable, but alas some are not.
  13. 35bore

    35bore AH Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2009
    Messages:
    2,020
    Likes Received:
    5
    My Photos:
    72
    Member of:
    NRA,Missouri hunters ed, SCI, Owensville Gun Club, Quail Forever
    Hunted:
    USA, South Africa, France
    Ditto, perfect response. 4 of the 5 animals I took in SA were one shot kills/ even after extensive training prior to the trip and the PH telling me the first shot was "spot on", that damn Gemsbok did not fall after 2 direct shots to the shoulder. Maybe there was a branch I didn't see, maybe there wasn't, or maybe the PH was seeing the whole thing unfold and I couldn't. When he didnt fall I thought I botched the shot 1st, 2nd and 3rd shot, he said 1st and 3rd were on, whatever, the animal went a long way and died is my guess. Point is, nobody has a perfect track record, NOBODY, just sucks when this kind of misfortune hits you right in the face.

    As far as the original question, yes, it does get old watching edited film where you can plainly see the shot was F'ed up, but the next scene is of a great hunter standing or kneeling behind his quarry. Again, whatever, successful hunts on video is what sells, plain and simple. If they showed a bunch of animals that had been shot poorly PITA and other animal rights groups would have a field day. So, Enjoy or don't. If you are tired of it, do like I did, stop watching them. After being to Africa, hell I'd rather read a book about Africa and visualize it myself.

    Happy hunting.
  14. Upton O. Good

    Upton O. Good AH Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2010
    Messages:
    203
    Likes Received:
    3
    My Photos:
    23
    Member of:
    NRA Life member, Nature Conservancy, Dallas Safari Club
    Hunted:
    Zimbabwe, South Africa, Canada, Mexico, Louisiana
    I won't discuss what I see on TV, I'll discuss my shooting.

    A about a year and a half ago I agreed to take the plunge and do my "trip of a lifetime" to South Africa. I was going to focus on bird hunting and maybe shoot an impala or warthog if the opportunity presented itself. Well, 5 hours into the hunt I had put down a really nice kudu and the hunt shifted. And so did my shooting. I shot terribly.

    Now I had been warned by the outfitter before my trip to shoot my rifle a lot, from the STICKS, at photographic targets of plains game animals which I didn't do. My shooting was an embarrassment to me and my PH though he was just always supportive and helpful. Thankfully, if I can say that, I only wounded one animal that we didn't recover and one one of the seven I killed required two shots. I either killed the game or missed it. The lost animal was the first I'd ever lost like that in my life, it haunts me today.

    I vowed I'd never fail to be prepared like that again. I did everything the outfitter told me to do plus I only allowed myself four seconds to get the rifle onto the sticks at the range and fire the first shot. I then fired a quick follow up shot, and reloaded from my ammo pack on my belt. Then I would put the rifle down, open the chamber and check my bullet placement with the spotting scope. I shot out to ranges of 250 yards.

    I returned to South Africa this year, I fired 13 shots, killed 10 animals, one took two rounds to kill though both bullets were through the lungs (black wildebeest). I missed a running springbok cull with a bad leg on the first shot, dropped it on the second. The last day I missed a hurried shot at an impala. My steenbok and duiker were at 180 to 200 yards, the bushbuck 300 yards (prone position). The other trophies were 80-150 yards. NO wounded animals, no lost animals.

    This isn't me bragging, I just want to make a point: to shoot badly due to lack of preparation is a sin and a crime. It embarrasses me to tell the first part of my experience.

    I haven't shot dangerous game yet, I might one day. If I do, I know adrenaline is going to be pumping, it is, after all, dangerous game. When that day comes, the PH is to back me up as soon as necessary for the honor of the game animal, the safety of others.

    You play like you practice. And even the pros practice a lot.
  15. Norwegianwoods

    Norwegianwoods SILVER SUPPORTER AH Elite

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2011
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    23
    My Photos:
    29
    Hunted:
    Norway, Sweden, England, South Africa
    I totally agree that no one is perfect and everybody will wound an animal or more during hunting if you hunt much.
    I also have no problems with bad shots shown on TV or videos.

    But I have a big problem with it when they lie about it and pretend it was a good shot.
    I also have a big problem with it when it happens rather often and even gets trivialized like it is not a big deal when an animal gets wounded.

    I have tracked down and killed well over 100 wounded deer. And 6 of them were animals I had wounded myself. Besides the 6 animals I had wounded myself and caught up with successfully, I have also not been able to catch up with 3 more animals(2 Roe deer and 1 Blesbuck) that I have wounded myself.
    My wounding percentage with a rifle is very low and I hope to keep it that way.
    I hope I can keep it very low with a bow as well.

    In about half of the situations I have wounded animals, it happened because something was wrong with the gun/mount/scope.
    The rest of them happened because I made a wrong decision and took the shot when I should not have done it.
    And hopefully I have learned from that, and I think I have.

    But when it comes to the 100+ tracking jobs I have done for other hunters, then I can clearly say that most of the woundings is a result of hunters making a wrong decision and taking shots when they shouldn't or/and because they lack the shooting skills needed. Hail Mary shots have been giving me many tracking jobs.

    Nothing wrong in hunters getting buck fever while hunting. What is wrong is when they still make the decision to take the shot even if they are shaking so bad that they hardly have the animal within their sight.
    I totally respect the hunter that chooses to not take the shot at an animal even if the PH and whoever else nag them to shoot.
    Only the hunter knows how it looks like in his/her scope and how confident he/she feels about the shot.
    If a PH would start to nag me to take a shot, I would secure my gun, walk back and demand another PH.

    I also think this is a problem for the people in front of the camera in hunting TV shows and videos.
    They feel a huge pressure to take the shot on camera and either take low percentage shots or/and make bad shots because of the stress.
    When they do, they should either not show it or they should be honest about it.

    If they make many crap shots in front of the camera, they should find something else to do.
  16. 35bore

    35bore AH Legend

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2009
    Messages:
    2,020
    Likes Received:
    5
    My Photos:
    72
    Member of:
    NRA,Missouri hunters ed, SCI, Owensville Gun Club, Quail Forever
    Hunted:
    USA, South Africa, France
    Sorry "PETA", typo, u gyus no'ed whut I mint.

Share This Page