.375H&H or .416Rem PLUS another heavy stopper? Or just a .375H&H/.416Rem?
This is a discussion on .375H&H or .416Rem PLUS another heavy stopper? Or just a .375H&H/.416Rem? within the Introductions & Greets forums, part of the AfricaHunting.com category; I attended the BASA shoot in Centurion, Pretoria this weekend and was very happy to see like-minded individuals in one ...
11-23-2011, 09:39 AM #1
.375H&H or .416Rem PLUS another heavy stopper? Or just a .375H&H/.416Rem?
I attended the BASA shoot in Centurion, Pretoria this weekend and was very happy to see like-minded individuals in one place. Heavy doubles, big bores, stoppers, dangerous game etc. The list goes on surrounding the talk that sweetened the air.
It was my first time in such an environment and to say the least I was welcomed by all with open arms. I learnt about the procedures involved before, during, and after all the shooting. What I also picked up as I sliently scouted the environment for valuable knowldge, is that I may have it all wrong... Why do I need to buy a medium-heavy calibre such as a .375H&H or .416Rem AND a a heavy stopper in , for example, .470NE? Do I, as an aspiring big 5 hunter and hunting consultant really really need to own the former? Maybe just .375 is adequete...
I have not purchased any of the above yet, but I have almost settled on the .416Rem and finances permitting a .470 NE. But, after having taken the general trend of conversation to lean towards "saving money", I realised that I may just be biting off more than I can chew.
What quantifies a purchase for a heavy .45+ double? Will I benefit from such a purchasewhen my ph could fill in that gap anyway? I realise that when buying especially larger calibres, reloading is the way to go. But I have no experience in reloading and I will only take it up upon the accreditation of my company.
Should I just go ahead and make financial plans for a medium-heavy PLUS heavy double/bolt? Or should I, for now, just buy the former?
11-23-2011, 10:45 AM #2
- Member of NAHC Life Member, NRA Life Member,SCI, Buckmasters
- Hunted USA(from Coast to Coast and Alaska), Germany, South Africa, Canada
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As for me I think it's just a personal preference I myself like more then 2 shots in my rifle when hunting big game even when most of the time 1 shot is all it takes and a .378-.416 is plenty of gun for hunting anything. also you may want to get with Jerome and have this thread moved to Africa Hunting for more members to view and comment on.
11-23-2011, 11:38 AM #3
- Member of Northeast Wisconsin SCI chapter, Lifetime member of NRA,RMEF
- Hunted Namibia, South Africa (East Cape, Guateng and Limpopo)
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I think if you can afford it and don't mind the recoil, the 416 Rem in a bolt action gun and double in the .470 NE in would be the way to go in a two gun purchase. If you cut it to one gun, why not just a bolt action 416 Rem.
11-23-2011, 12:25 PM #4
- Member of KZN Hunters Assoc
- Hunted Namibia (Otavi, Ozondjache) South Africa ( LP, KZN, NC, EC) Botswana (Ghanzi) Canada (BC, AB, SK, MB, Ont, PQ, NS) USA (MT, WA, SD, CA, CO, WY, KS, MN, NC, VG, UT, HI)
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David Sutherland votes for the .375 and well placed shots.
As Bob says it is personal preference.
E is dreaming about additions to his gun cabinet again.Practice whispering before you leave for Africa!
A Legend in my own mind!
11-24-2011, 01:28 AM #5
11-24-2011, 07:39 AM #6
- Member of NRA, ATA, PITA, NAHC, NAFC, DU, TU, DSC, SCI, RMEF
- Hunted USA - Canada -Tanzania, South Africa, Zimbabwe, Africa
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While at these big bore shoots see if you can shoot as many different medium to big bore rifles as you can.
Seeing as you have not made the plunge at this time study to see what you can handle.
Do not lock your self in to a 416 Remington, just because.
I am sure that i have missed some and i do not want to dig out the ammo & Ballistics 4 book to post them all. Here are some for you to look at.
375 H & H
416 Remington & Rigby
458 Lott & Winchester
Build your self a check list after you have tried the various medium and Big Bore rifles out and do an analysis of the different rounds tried see what you can afford.
The 404 & 416 Rigby have been around for a long time and have a great history of use in Africa and seem to fill the one rifle idea that you have suggested.
The last thing you need to look at is ammunition and see what is available to purchase over the counter on your safari/hunting trips.James Grage - New Mexico
Hold a steady Eye & Rifle...
"Very few of the so-called liberals are open-minded...they shout you down and won't let you speak if you disagree with them." John Wayne
11-24-2011, 08:41 AM #8
Thanks pal, I certainly enjoy a sense of ernesty. If i had it my way I would buy every rifle that Mauser ever made, every rifle Winchester ever made...and so on. I hear you I really do, just wish I had the millions to do it. If my financial situation si fitting I will consider the .416/.470 combo!
11-24-2011, 08:54 AM #9
I grew up on a .270win then later a .375h&h CZ. This rifle/cartridge "fits" me in terms of handling recoil and i never ever flinch before i discharge a round. I imagine the .416rem not being too different as it is based on the 8mmRem which is based on the .375H&H case. I fired a Krieghoff double in .470 at the BASA shoot this weekend and lets just say i underestimated that first round... But it came at a price in Rands per cartridge fired so i narrowed it down to one setting of two rounds.
I hope to use the info you've given me at the big bore shoots, but not every ph/outfitter etc is so willing to let x amount of dollars of led go flying down the barrel of their favourite Purdey! Not enough to quench my thirst for knowledge. But thanks. I will perservere.
11-24-2011, 12:27 PM #10
For me the 375 H&H in a bolt gun and 470 Nitro in a double is my favorite combination for a safari. You are covered from duiker to elephant and the 375 can reach pretty far out with no trouble.
If I was going with one gun for PG and DG it would be a 416 Rem, Rigby, Ruger, or Taylor.
One of my buddies owns an over and under .416 Rigby by Merkel - one of the most beautiful rifles I've ever held! The balance, the slimness, the finish was just incredible! I've heard criticism about it that you have to open the barrels too far down to eject the bottom case, but I don't really know if that'd be enough reason for me not to buy it! It had mounts for a scope and the nice thing about it was the barrels shot absolutely parallel to each other!
With guns there's always just the right toy! This was to me the best of both worlds! I would have bought it if I'd had the folding!
11-25-2011, 07:29 AM #12
I was considering a Merkel in .470 side by side. No case ejectors and engravings. I dont really care for aesthetics (though I think the Merkel is easy on the eye) but I wonder if not having case ejectors may land me in a sticky situation one day. To buy one with ejectors and engavings etc is almost half the price more (if i remember correctly). There is an order coming through at the gunshop i frequent; .416 Rigby's, .470NE, 45/70'S, and 9,3x74. All side by side doubles with or without ejectors and engravings. Ammunition seems to be the key in all of this though, availability and cost-effectiveness, that and what I feel comfortable with. Otheriwse Merkel seems like a good company but I have never seen one live or fired one...
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