Hunting Lion

Maybe just search the internet and buy one already mounted, could save on air travel, day rate, trophy fees and all that.

South Africa started "Canned" lion hunting in the 1980's and it became a huge industry. SCI played along and have only recently backed out. Lions in captivity breed like rabbits. These were hand reared cubs (pets) and artificially fed up to and including adult size. Breeders would come to the SCI conventions with photo albums and prices on each photo. It was inspired by greed as the cost and difficulty of lion hunting in Africa increased. It could have also given the "anti-hunting bunny huggers" legitimate reason to condem us all - but fortunately they missed the opportunity.
There is still nowhere in South Africa for a real lion hunt. It's not the size of the fenced area. It's simply that the value of the game which a wild lion needs to reach adult trophy is prohibitive for game ranchers. High fencing laws are different for lion and antelope. Most have a small area electrified and double fenced area for lion. To "lion fence" 5000 acres is also a prohibitive cost. Finally as we have seen in our National Parks, protected wild lions have a poor breeding success rate - which is why they might need CITIES protection. Most of our parks don't have lions.
There are still operators here getting around the law. The cubs are hand reared (to keep the adult males from killing them), they are artificially fed, and when the client arrives the trophy is often moved to a large area of 1000 acres or more where antelope and zebra roam. The poor lion (like your dog) comes running when he hears people and the vehicle approaching - like ringing the dinner bell. He might not be drugged but he's still a "tame" animal with no fear of man. The old "canned lion hunting" may be technically illegal here but there are loopholes in the law and enforcement is still poor. If you want a genuine African lion safari it should not be in South Africa.

"It is my opinion that Danilocf is not only misinformed but is a child as well, and getting through to him is like, as someone said earlier, banging you head against a brick wall. This young man has some citified ideas as to what hunting is all about, and equates hunting with money and shooting. What he is leaving out is the HUNTING part! The concept of HUNTING is as foreign to him as if he were from MARS. "

I let someone nervous! The forum is about lion hunting. Show me lions who walk miles at no fences area if they have enough food near them.

Danilocf,
Lion do travel great distances even when food is plentiful and daytime temperatures climb above 40"c.
It is a fallacy that they are lazy.

Hi Jumbo,

You are a serious PH and know lion habits. A question is the lion defend the pride and they patrol and mark their area with urine and faeces. The size of lion home territory depends on available resourcers. That's a fact. The food determinate the territory, and some specialists said that it can be between 8 to 150 square miles. If it's right, you can find a lion group in territories between 5.120 acres to 96.000 acres (no fenced areas).
Best Regards
Danilo

Sorry, not Jumbo.
But understand, like most game, i.e. Elephant and Buffalo. There are many Male Lion without Prides that roam (Nomads that have yet to hold a pride or ones that have lost).

One that was without pride that was on its last season.

Nice cat!. The stories that old boy could tell.

Originally Posted by MacD37

"It is my opinion that Danilocf is not only misinformed but is a child as well, and getting through to him is like, as someone said earlier, banging you head against a brick wall. This young man has some citified ideas as to what hunting is all about, and equates hunting with money and shooting. What he is leaving out is the HUNTING part! The concept of HUNTING is as foreign to him as if he were from MARS. "

Originally Posted by danilocf

I let someone nervous! The forum is about lion hunting. Show me lions who walk miles at no fences area if they have enough food near them.

Danilocf, it is easy to see that English is not your first language, and I think we are loosing something in the translation, in both directions. If I'm misunderstanding you then I apologies, but I think I have your opinion down correctly.

Wild lion don't have to travel long distances in a straight line as in migrating, to avoid a hunter. Once he realizes he is being followed he may make several changes in directions, or even leave the pride all together if he is a pride member. If he happens to be a satellite male he may simply take off and out distance you, or take cover in rocks or very dense bush/high grass and wait for you when he gets tired. These tactics are not easy in an enclosure, because sooner or later he is going to get in a corner where he has no place else to run.

The problem with high electric double fenced lion the young lions have to be separated from the adult lions, or the males in the enclosure will kill them, and because of this these young lions have to be cared for by humans till they are old enough to fend for themselves. They become imprinted on humans and become dependant on them for food. This is bad because once turned out in an enclosure, when they hear human voices, or the approaching hunting car they come to the sound expecting food. The exact opposite is true of a wild lion. He hears a vehicle or human voices he hides and if those sounds get too close he runs to avoid them.

You seem to think baiting is not hunting, but shooting a lion that has been conditioned to come to human sounds, is! That is an amazing thought process to say the least!

A wild lion my come to one of ten baits you set, and they can't be just set any old place, but requires some intelligence and knowledge of lions to know where these baits are best placed. Even then if the lion and/or leopard comes to one of the baits you may not be at that bait when he does. Additionally he may come in after shooting hours are over, and leave before it is legal to shoot, for all the days you have and you go home without even a shot at a lion. That is the difference between HUNTING, and SHOOTING! A sure thing is not HUNTING. That is what I meant in my post about having only considered the money spent, for as shortest time spent there, and the shooting of a lion, and you seem to forget the HUNTING altogether!

As I and others have said many times if that is what you want to do, the do it, but don't make the mistake that because you went home with a lion trophy that you have also experienced lion HUNTING, because you could do the same thing you did in a zoo, if they'd let you!

SO, shoot a lion in a cage and be happy, but do not try to convince anyone who hunts for real, that your lion was fair chase, any more than it would be if you paid the taxidermist to gas a zoo lion and mount it for you and ship it to you, at home, so you didn't have to fly to Africa, or even drive to the zoo!

............................BYE now! I'll leave you with your opinions because I don't see you changing your mind, no matter what anyone says to you.

Originally Posted by DUGABOY1

Danilocf, it is easy to see that English is not your first language, and I think we are loosing something in the translation, in both directions. If I'm misunderstanding you then I apologies, but I think I have your opinion down correctly.

Wild lion don't have to travel long distances in a straight line as in migrating, to avoid a hunter. Once he realizes he is being followed he may make several changes in directions, or even leave the pride all together if he is a pride member. If he happens to be a satellite male he may simply take off and out distance you, or take cover in rocks or very dense bush/high grass and wait for you when he gets tired. These tactics are not easy in an enclosure, because sooner or later he is going to get in a corner where he has no place else to run.

The problem with high electric double fenced lion the young lions have to be separated from the adult lions, or the males in the enclosure will kill them, and because of this these young lions have to be cared for by humans till they are old enough to fend for themselves. They become imprinted on humans and become dependant on them for food. This is bad because once turned out in an enclosure, when they hear human voices, or the approaching hunting car they come to the sound expecting food. The exact opposite is true of a wild lion. He hears a vehicle or human voices he hides and if those sounds get too close he runs to avoid them.

You seem to think baiting is not hunting, but shooting a lion that has been conditioned to come to human sounds, is! That is an amazing thought process to say the least!

A wild lion my come to one of ten baits you set, and they can't be just set any old place, but requires some intelligence and knowledge of lions to know where these baits are best placed. Even then if the lion and/or leopard comes to one of the baits you may not be at that bait when he does. Additionally he may come in after shooting hours are over, and leave before it is legal to shoot, for all the days you have and you go home without even a shot at a lion. That is the difference between HUNTING, and SHOOTING! A sure thing is not HUNTING. That is what I meant in my post about having only considered the money spent, for as shortest time spent there, and the shooting of a lion, and you seem to forget the HUNTING altogether!

As I and others have said many times if that is what you want to do, the do it, but don't make the mistake that because you went home with a lion trophy that you have also experienced lion HUNTING, because you could do the same thing you did in a zoo, if they'd let you!

SO, shoot a lion in a cage and be happy, but do not try to convince anyone who hunts for real, that your lion was fair chase, any more than it would be if you paid the taxidermist to gas a zoo lion and mount it for you and ship it to you, at home, so you didn't have to fly to Africa, or even drive to the zoo!

............................BYE now! I'll leave you with your opinions because I don't see you changing your mind, no matter what anyone says to you.

And that, my friend, pretty sums it up quite nicely. Well said.

Originally Posted by DUGABOY1

Danilocf, . . . shoot a lion in a cage and be happy, but do not try to convince anyone who hunts for real, that your lion was fair chase, any more than it would be if you paid the taxidermist to gas a zoo lion and mount it for you and ship it to you, at home, so you didn't have to fly to Africa, or even drive to the zoo!

'Skyline's' reemphasis of 'Dugaboy's' post beat me to the punch. But the above summation bears repeating. . . especially to those as hopelessly misinformed as 'Danilocf'.

Hi, I continuous misinformed.
A serious PH, Christophe Morio, shows us an amaizing hunting 20 days trip with 20 animals, in Tanzania, included a lion and a leopard.
I will pay for him for this hunt, but never walk behind the guide for 15 or 20 for only a lion and pay $1.500,00 a day.

Best Regards

Danilo

I guarentee if you book with Christophe Morio, you will go on a real lion hunt and have great memories after the hunt is over.

Originally Posted by danilocf

. . . an amaizing hunting 20 days trip with 20 animals, in Tanzania, included a lion and a leopard. I will pay for him for this hunt, but never walk behind the guide for 15 or 20 for only a lion and pay $1.500,00 a day.

danilocf, you seem to be of the mistaken belief that each day of a true free range hunt is exclusively devoted to the pursuit of only a single game species. From your many posts I am convinced that you really do need to stick to your favored high electric double fenced enclosure way of shooting animals and forever dismiss any thought of booking a true hunt. Free range animals don't wear a name tag and they do not come when you whistle.

I wish you the best of luck in the electrified barnyard of your next hunt.

Hi, I continuous misinformed, Big Five.

If I book one lion hunt why I will have to kill others animals?

If I will have time, something is wrong.

Danilo

Just so you know, on Lion and Leopard hunts (free range) you will need to kill more game as you do need bait as this is the main method of hunting big cats.
You will also spend a great deal of time driving from bait to bait to see what is hit.
A lot of time is required in the Toyota even when on tracking hunts.
I would also suggest bringing along a game camera or two as it can save many hours driving to and from a bait sight and sitting only to find the Lion is not suitable.

danilocf . . . I have come to believe that you must be 'jerking everyone's chain' or you have very little hunting experience. Perhaps both. In any event I find myself unable to take your comparisons and insistence that hunting lion in an electrified fenced enclosure is on an equal par with that of a true free range hunt seriously.

If by the slightest chance you are serious I will again wish you the best of luck as you enter some electrified barnyard for your next so-called 'hunting adventure'. To each his own.

Hi,

I will never give up.

I'm not stupid. African hunt have to be saved from PH who only want's money.
Track an animal like a lion for many days is unreal.
If you are make money with that, I understand your position.

Best Regars

Originally Posted by danilocf

I will never give up. . . I'm not stupid. . . Track an animal like a lion for many days is unreal.

Yes, danilocf, you certainly have shown yourself to be someone of superior intelligence and vast knowledge on the subject of lion hunting. Wink, wink!

I again wish you the best of luck as you enter some electrified barnyard somewhere in search of what you believe to be a true hunting adventure.

I'm not afraid to be wrong. But I have a name and photos at this site. I pay for to hunt. Who are you big five? Show me your experience and may be I will agree with you.
Best Regards
Danilo

Originally Posted by danilocf

Who are you big five? Show me your experience and may be I will agree with you.

Danilocf. . . please take note that I have not once asked that you agree with me.

What I’ve objected to in your many posts on the subject is your insistence that shooting a lion in a fenced enclosure is on an equal or even greater par than that of a true free range lion hunt. You’ve suggested that there is little challenge to a true free range lion hunt. You’ve diminished true lion hunt as nothing more than an afternoon stroll and taking a 200-300 yard pot shot at a lion snoozing under a shade tree. You’ve insulted those who’ve participated in true lion hunts by saying they’ve wasted time and money on their challenge by way of taking too many days to locate a lion before lobbing that 200-300 yard shot at him, etc., etc. All of which is complete nonsense.

You’ve asked for my hunting experience background. I would say that it’s a bit more than some and a whole lot less than others. In brief summation;
I’ve been hunting big game of one sort or another for 50+ years now. Without undue elaboration I’ve been fortunate to have hunted a wide variety of big game on four continents now and I’ve been on 15 African safaris. Of those 15 safaris 3 have included free range hunts for lion.

I hope that brief and general summation of my 50+ years of big game hunting will satisfy your interest. I further hope that my humble hunting experience is sufficient to match your own. If so, perhaps it may add a slight measure of credibility to my point of view on the subject.

Please feel free to support your preference for shooting a lion in a fenced enclosure as you wish. However, when you disparage classic free range lion hunting, by innuendo or otherwise, as something less than a real challenge and you insult those who meet that challenge I will remain free to challenge your remarks.