.270 Winchester for plains game
This is a discussion on .270 Winchester for plains game within the Hunting Africa forums, part of the Hunting Forums - Hunting in Africa category; Christian The reason that African PHs tend to turn up their noses at the 270, and other smaller calibers, is ...
The reason that African PHs tend to turn up their noses at the 270, and other smaller calibers, is that, in my experience, they have by and large bought into the big bullet at moderate velocity ballistics theory as opposed to the small bullet at high speed theory. In fact if you really want a reaction, just say the word "weatherby" to them. They place their faith on penetration as opposed to hydrostatic shock or energy transfer. A big old bullet that penetrates through the heart may not expand much, but it will always kill the trophy and it will never blow up on the shoulder.
I'm not trying to highjack the thread and open the big & slow vs small fast debate, just trying to shed light on the reaction that you got to the 270.
Full disclosure, I prefer a 45 because while your 9mm might expand, my 45 sure wont shrink.
i got a doe on Saturday with a .270 150. The .270 150 grain sure did a nice job on that doe! It broke both shoulders and exited out the other side. I sure was impressed! Now I am going to try do get a buck with it, we'll see what happens.....
After hearing and seeing firsthand that PH's like big bullets at moderate velocities, I think I am going to get a 9.3X57 in a Husqvarna model 46. That should satisfy them... I mean what is not to like, a big 286 grainer at 2050 (+ or -), Mauser 96 CRF action, and Iron sights. Sounds good to me.
12-06-2010, 10:33 AM #64
12-06-2010, 05:30 PM #65
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9.3X62 would be better. I owned one. the 57 is popular in Europe but the 62 was developed for Africa as the German 375H&H equivalent. There's still nothing wrong with a 30-06
If I am going to get a 9.3, it is going to be a Husky. The Husqvarna model 146 comes in 9.3X62, but it is a Mauser 98 action, not a 96 Mauser action. I want a light rifle, Mauser 96 action ( a considerably lighter action than the 98 ),open sights, and a lot of "thump"at 200 yards and under. A Mauser 98 action probably adds almost 1 pound to the rifle, thereby defeating the purpose.
12-16-2010, 07:47 PM #67
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As far as the 270 is concerned it is a fine rifle, and I think we all agree that #1 is shot placement. In my gun safe I have several rifles that I like to hunt with 243, 270, 300WM, 45-70 sharpes and yes even a 30-30, I reload my own ammo and that helps to work up good loads but you can do the same thing with some of the new ammo like Hornady custom loads from the factory the Hornady SST that I am loading this year is a good bullet for just about all plains game animals I shot a wild pig the other day while deer hunting useing my 270 150gr SST through one shoulder and out the other, it left a blood trail a blind man could have tracked I found the pig laying in the brush only 40 yards away. What I'm getting at is stick with what you feel Comfortable with if you have any Doubt then go bigger 300 win mag would then be my Recommendation. Bob
12-17-2010, 09:35 PM #69
12-18-2010, 01:56 PM #71
About 6 years ago on my first Arizona elk hunt, I killed an older 6x6 bull at 280 yards. Again using the 160 grain partition. The bullet hit a little high as I was shooting downhill and exited the animal just below the midline of the offside shoulder. The elk dropped in it's tracks. He didn't die just right away and I used a .45 for a mercy shot when we reached him (that was one tough old bull).
My 7mm has been changed a bit in the last few years and now is setup to be my Coues deer rifle for the longer shots we have for those little deer. So I haven't used it for elk in a few years now and after killing one with my bow this year I don't know that I'll ever rifle hunt elk again.
I bought a Tikka T3 Light in .300 Win. Magnum for my safari. It will surely kill an elk with no problem and has been a favorite of western elk hunters for many years. I would probably shy away from the 200 grain bullets, to lessen the recoil and use a 180 grain myself. But either way it would be a Nosler Partition, Swift A-Frame or perhaps the North Fork version.
The T3 Light is as it's name suggests a lightweight rifle and is a joy to carry for long walks typical of an elk hunt. I was a little concerned with the recoil, but put a Limbsaver pad on it and with that the recoil is really no big deal. It is the typical magnum sharp crack, but that pad does it's job very well as does the Pachmayr Decelerator on my .375 H&H.
Again I've got nothing against the .300 Weatherby, it's just more than I think you need for what you're after. That said, you've got the cost issue of ammunition for the Weatherby. I also have a friend who had a Weatherby rifle in that calibre and he could never get it to group and has since sold it. Just one man's experience I guess, but it's a datapoint, a rather expensive datapoint however.
I guess my longwinded point is whether you choose a 7mm, .300 Win or .300 Weatherby, the elk will go down no problem provided you use a good bullet and place it well.
For years the only two rifles I had were a .270 and the 7mm. Why? Because I was living in Idaho primarily hunting mule deer and elk. If one rifle was down for some reason, I could use the other no matter what species I was hunting. A .270 may be a little on the light side for elk (don't tell Jack O'Connor that however), but I wouldn't hesitate to use it on elk either.
12-19-2010, 01:35 AM #72
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I would have to say that Phil really gave you some good advice.
The 7mm can be deadly as a client illustrated for me this year he dropped 5 animals in a row and one of them was a Sable. Just goes to show that good shot placement is key!
However to play devil’s advocate a bit here I own a 300 Weatherby have been shooting it since the age of 8 it is not regarded as a fine African calibre by most but just to give some practical examples we shot an Eland early on this year Ty shot him right on the shoulder I was a bit worried about how the bullet will hold up?
Well he broke the front shoulder and we found the bullet logged under the skin of the opposite shoulder.
Ty used my Weatherby for his entire hunt he even nailed a Giraffe bull on a frontal shot witch really impressed me please go ahead and read his hunt report:
We used Federal Premium bullets.
I am currently shooting some Barns TXS 180gr’s I will let you know how they work?
Bottom line is if you are thinking of the Weatherby make sure to use good bullets.
I hope this helps?
Louis van Bergen
I am not really afraid of the recoil, I was actually overreacting about recoil when I started this thread. I have no problems shooting 12 gauge with 2 3/4 or 3 " shot or slugs, .30-06, 7.62X54R (Mosin Nagant), .303 British (not a high recoiling round by any means), .270 Win, 8X57 Mauser, .35 Remington, or .30-40 Krag. Some of these rounds I listed recoil only a little more than the .30-30, but others such as the 7.62X54R (especially with the steel buttplate), .270, 12 gauge, and .35 Remington have very similar recoil to the '06. What I am trying to say is, I am not recoil intolerant. A friend let me shoot his Winchester model 70 in .375 H&H (270 Grain Hornady factory load) and I loved it, in fact I would've shot it again if he would've offered. So, I don't feel overly intimadated by these other cartridges I have been talking about.
I am also considering the .338 Win mag. What do you guys think? Keep in mind, I am going to have a few years to "grow up".
12-20-2010, 12:56 PM #75
One other note, while it's great you're not recoil intolerant, there's no need either to abuse your shoulder more than you need to if you do a fair amount of range/target shooting.
There are 2 cartridges that would be better suited for me (I believe), the .350 Remington mag and the .35 Whelen. I really like those two cartridges. However, I can't think of a rifle in either chambering that I really want? I could be missing something but I don't see anything like a Ruger M77 or Winchester model 70 in either cartridge? As far as Remington model 7's and 700's, I don't want to pay $800+ for a push feed. What cartridge I get is really up to my dad, but it is fun too talk about it nonetheless.
12-21-2010, 02:40 PM #77
[QUOTE=Christian Snyder;19911]I already have my range rifles, a .22 L.R, .270, and a 7.62X54R. I am NOT planning on taking any .300 WBY., .338 Win mag, or .375 H&H to the range for "target shooting". Those cartridges I would only shoot to make sure my rifle is sighted in and to shoot at an animal.
I would not recommend this...it's asking for trouble....I think it's wonderful to shoot with a cheap rifle and bullet to learn how to shoot. I shoot a 22 Ruger 10/22carbine and Ruger M77 .223 for that purpose....but shooting a 300 Win Mag to 458 Lott...is not good. Recoil has to be learned to be dealt with properly. I have seen way to many bad shots...because people don't practise with their hunting rifle....I swear in Wisconsin it's a tradition to miss. Scopes end up in people's eyes and forehead....the list goes on and on....food for thought.
There are a lot of veteran hunters like browningbbr and Mike70560 that will agree with me on this one.
As far as getting "scope bit", I know from personal experience what that is like. OUCH! Luckily it didn't cause me to develop a flinch.
12-22-2010, 11:24 AM #79
[QUOTE=Christian Snyder;19956][QUOTE=enysse;19932] I understand what you're saying. However, I would not shoot a .458 Lott as much as I would a .30-06, they just aren't all that fun to shoot. That doesn't mean I wouldn't shoot the .458 Lott until I am comfortable with the recoil, but that doesn't mean I want to shoot until the barrel wears out either!
Ok, I was checking on your answer. I have shot a 416 rigby and 375 H&H before...just to familiarize myself from all the shooting positions...but hey, you are right...20 rounds a day is more than enough. Some guys like "big bores" and shooting them...some just tolerate it because it's required for the animal you are hunting.
12-22-2010, 12:05 PM #80
If you shoot big bores enough it will loosen your brain and the felt recoil goes away.
Seriously, it is important to wring out your rifle before you go. Africa is not the place to find you have a problem. I like to fire at least 200 rounds in each rifle before departing. It also builds confidence in my shooting ability.
Whatever you choose just learn to shoot it. And no matter what caliber and what bullet you use, some will say it is the greatest and others will say it does not work.
My minimum (Note "MY" it is my opinion only) for plainsgame would be a 300 Win Mag if not hunting DG (borderline to me for eland) or a 375 H&H if DG is on the menu also.
Once you learn to shoot a big bore (Even a 458 Lott) correctly and if the rifle fits properly the recoil is not that bad.
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