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"Military style" weapons for hunting????

This is a discussion on "Military style" weapons for hunting???? within the Firearms & Ammunition forums, part of the HUNTING EQUIPMENT, FIREARMS & AMMUNITION category; Personally, I am against such rifles for sports hunting of any kind. If you are an experienced good skilled hunter, ...

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    Doubleriflejack is offline AH Member
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    Personally, I am against such rifles for sports hunting of any kind. If you are an experienced good skilled hunter, you certainly don't need a semi-automatic rifle, especially one in most modern military calibers. I have shot a good number of deer, big bull elk, moose, in Montana, where I was born and raised, and here in Oregon too, and for each, needed only one or two shots; no more. I believe, as the late great Elmer Keith believed, that big game should not be shot with hyper-velocity needles, such as the .223 caliber, and similar. That caliber was designed specifically to tumble upon contacting tissue, for warfare wounding. I am convinced that most people who like, enjoy, and use military type rifles for hunting game, are inexperienced hunters; mostly young and naive.

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    the platforms come in 308, 30-06, and various other desired calibers. Barrel twist are varied also. Bullets can be the same as any other bullets used in sporting firearms.
    And, sporting firearms come in semi-auto also. I have a BAR 270 that I purchased in about 1989. It is no different from the ARs except in how it looks. Well, and that my clip only holds 4 rounds.
    I haven't shot that rifle at an animal in many years because I don't like the weight of it. My son now occasionally uses it.
    Semi-auto BAR and AR in same caliber??? same thing, different wrapping paper.

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    rphguy
    Yes, I know. I have no problem with the use of sporting fireams, semi-auto or not, but I do have a problem with, as I mentioned in writing above, and often mentioned too by the late Elmer Keith, needle bullets shot at hyper-velocity. Yes, the BAR (Browning automatic Rifle), designed by the late great John Browning of Utah, was used in warfare, but is suitable for medium game hunting; a four round magazine is "sporting" enough, but, as you say, they are dated and weigh way too much for gains received. They don't attract the young crowd seeking the modern military look. The AR and similar modern offshoots of military rifles, attract too many inexperienced young fools, simply due to design appearances of said rifles, wrapping paper that attracts those intend on harming others, an attraction that often leads to problems for them and for others, which I am against, and also, they often are chambered in aforementioned needle bullet calibers shot at hyper-velocity, horrible as a big game rifle; not suitable by any experienced big game hunter. Finally, they often contain or are fitted up with high capacity magazines, certainly not needed for a sporting rifle, for sports hunting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by spike.t View Post
    have used Hk93 and beretta AR70 and AK47 to hunt 2 legged poacher things , dont know if that counts ?
    There's no season right, open year round? Guess it counts/
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    As I mentioned above, " I have no problem with the use of sporting fireams, semi-auto or not," though they certainly are not needed. Using them only shows that you are not much of a real hunter, a real " sports hunter." If your goal is just to kill something, you in no way are a sports hunter, in my opinion. Not everyone will fully understand what I mean by this, but the real hunters will.

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    I started hunting with ex-mil rifles (some semi-auto) in 'the good old days" in Australia. All I used was ex-mil FMJ (cheap) ammo too. The only thing it taught me was to get close because they were so innacurate, and how to shoot something in the head. As soon as I had enough money i bought a decent hunting rifle.

    Yobbos didn't make semi-autos restricted in Australia, we had a couple of mass shootings and the conservative Prime Minister at the time saw an opportunity to make some fast, cheap political mileage out of it. Not one conservative state or federal government since, has rolled back any of the laws that were introduced then.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doubleriflejack View Post
    rphguy
    Yes, I know. I have no problem with the use of sporting fireams, semi-auto or not, but I do have a problem with, as I mentioned in writing above, and often mentioned too by the late Elmer Keith, needle bullets shot at hyper-velocity. Yes, the BAR (Browning automatic Rifle), designed by the late great John Browning of Utah, was used in warfare, but is suitable for medium game hunting; a four round magazine is "sporting" enough, but, as you say, they are dated and weigh way too much for gains received. They don't attract the young crowd seeking the modern military look. The AR and similar modern offshoots of military rifles, attract too many inexperienced young fools, simply due to design appearances of said rifles, wrapping paper that attracts those intend on harming others, an attraction that often leads to problems for them and for others, which I am against, and also, they often are chambered in aforementioned needle bullet calibers shot at hyper-velocity, horrible as a big game rifle; not suitable by any experienced big game hunter. Finally, they often contain or are fitted up with high capacity magazines, certainly not needed for a sporting rifle, for sports hunting.
    This is the most "beside the point" post I have seen on this subject. Whether one in the US anyway, chooses to use such a rifle is a matter of choice and should not be legislated simply because of all the silly reasons mentioned above. Whether or not a hunter has served in any military has once again no impact on whether one should use such a rifle for hunting. If its legal and it should be, then whats the big deal? Too many people even on our side fall prey to this stupid notion that because the gun is mostly black, or has the dreaded high cap mag, or the mostly cosmetic dreaded bayonet lug, it should not be ALLOWED to be used for hunting. This is stupid. This idea that something is not "needed" to shoot a deer is equally preposterous! This is the same moronic attitude the left uses against us everyday in America. "Well no one needs an M16 to hunt deer with!" This is a most ridiculous argument. To say that the needle bullet guns are useless for hunting is also beyond silly. The .223 is more than capable of cleanly taking deer sized game and does so every year with proper bullets. I dont know every state game law but I would think that in the states where hunting with an AR rifle is legal, it is probably mandated that mag cap cannot exceed 5 rounds, so that argument is redundant. It just annoys the hell out of me when folks get all butt hurt about so-called assault rifles when the AR15 is no such thing. An actual assault rifle is fully auto capable. How many guys realize that true machine guns are legal in about 38 US states? How many of those legally owned and registered guns are used in crimes each year? Waiting....Thanks 35bore!

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    Quote Originally Posted by sestoppelman View Post
    This is the most "beside the point" post I have seen on this subject. Whether one in the US anyway, chooses to use such a rifle is a matter of choice and should not be legislated simply because of all the silly reasons mentioned above. Whether or not a hunter has served in any military has once again no impact on whether one should use such a rifle for hunting. If its legal and it should be, then whats the big deal? Too many people even on our side fall prey to this stupid notion that because the gun is mostly black, or has the dreaded high cap mag, or the mostly cosmetic dreaded bayonet lug, it should not be ALLOWED to be used for hunting. This is stupid. This idea that something is not "needed" to shoot a deer is equally preposterous! This is the same moronic attitude the left uses against us everyday in America. "Well no one needs an M16 to hunt deer with!" This is a most ridiculous argument. To say that the needle bullet guns are useless for hunting is also beyond silly. The .223 is more than capable of cleanly taking deer sized game and does so every year with proper bullets. I dont know every state game law but I would think that in the states where hunting with an AR rifle is legal, it is probably mandated that mag cap cannot exceed 5 rounds, so that argument is redundant. It just annoys the hell out of me when folks get all butt hurt about so-called assault rifles when the AR15 is no such thing. An actual assault rifle is fully auto capable. How many guys realize that true machine guns are legal in about 38 US states? How many of those legally owned and registered guns are used in crimes each year? Waiting....Thanks 35bore!
    ses

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    Quote Originally Posted by Biggdawg View Post
    to the op's question,

    i love the modern sporting rifle. here in iowa we can hunt every thing but deer with it. I only have one in 223 but i have 4 others in wildcats 20 practical, 7.62x40wt, 6.5pcc and now a 270AR. the 20 is excellent on coyote and down 32gn at 4100fps and 3/4" groups at 100.

    as someone else said they are very comfortable to shoot and very accurate.

    here are my 7.62x40, 20 practical, rossi 92 45lc, 6.5pcc

    just my ignorance on your calibers but, the 6.5 is the same as the 270 bullet, right? also that is a fantastic array of hardware buddy.
    "That which does not kill us makes us stronger" Friedrich Nietzsche // That which does not kill me, better run like hell" Scott Smith

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    Quote Originally Posted by 35bore View Post
    just my ignorance on your calibers but, the 6.5 is the same as the 270 bullet, right? also that is a fantastic array of hardware buddy.
    6.5 is .264 diameter and .270 is 6.8mm.

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    your right,,, my mind was in the wrong place when I was posting, I was thinking the 6.8 spc they came up with for SF in the middle east. brain fart on my part. thanks Scott.
    "That which does not kill us makes us stronger" Friedrich Nietzsche // That which does not kill me, better run like hell" Scott Smith

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doubleriflejack View Post
    rphguy
    Yes, I know. I have no problem with the use of sporting fireams, semi-auto or not, but I do have a problem with, as I mentioned in writing above, and often mentioned too by the late Elmer Keith, needle bullets shot at hyper-velocity. Yes, the BAR (Browning automatic Rifle), designed by the late great John Browning of Utah, was used in warfare, but is suitable for medium game hunting; a four round magazine is "sporting" enough, but, as you say, they are dated and weigh way too much for gains received. They don't attract the young crowd seeking the modern military look. The AR and similar modern offshoots of military rifles, attract too many inexperienced young fools, simply due to design appearances of said rifles, wrapping paper that attracts those intend on harming others, an attraction that often leads to problems for them and for others, which I am against, and also, they often are chambered in aforementioned needle bullet calibers shot at hyper-velocity, horrible as a big game rifle; not suitable by any experienced big game hunter. Finally, they often contain or are fitted up with high capacity magazines, certainly not needed for a sporting rifle, for sports hunting.
    As I have said in the past we are all entitled to our own opinion, however I don't think I have slammed another hunter based on his/her choice of rifle/caliber. If I have, my apologies (pretty sure I have just given opinion based on my experience) but never called anyone a bad or a non-experienced hunter based on one's choice.... One of the things you seem to have a problem with are the looks. Looks and titles for these rifles are and have been distorted, IN MY OPINION. Black rifles look scary and devious, but have practical applications in the hunting world and are absolutley NO different from a semi auto that is wood and Iron. Most states have a magazine capacity restriction for hunting applications. Here in Missouri the restriction is a 10 round magazine. I don't know a single person around me that has ever fired 10 rounds at a Whitetail. My 35 holds 5 and the most i have ever fired at an animal is 2 shots, yes some of us mere mortals do miss with the first shot from time to time. I don't think with this style rifle (AR10 AR15) it's a matter of need for the larger magazine, it's a matter of choice. When I hunt Coyote with the 15, even though I have a 30 round magazine for it, I always hit the woods with a 10 rounder... That's my choice. DRJ, again, I respect that you have an opinion on this, just that I don't like your opinion on this topic.
    "That which does not kill us makes us stronger" Friedrich Nietzsche // That which does not kill me, better run like hell" Scott Smith

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    Every high power rifle I have hunted with or owned started life as a military weapon. I started with a 30-40 Krag, then moved to an 03 Springfield, and now have Mausers in 6 differant calibers. I don't have a AR but have thought about getting one just for fun and varmits. I personally don't feel a .223 is a good deer cartridge, but I know several do. To each there own. I prefer to be over guned rather then under. To hunt deer with an AR in 308 with a 10 shot mag sounds like a lot of fun. If you want to hunt with a 30rd mag so you blast away at everything in the woods and kill everything in site you are not a hunter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 35bore View Post
    just my ignorance on your calibers but, the 6.5 is the same as the 270 bullet, right? also that is a fantastic array of hardware buddy.
    thanks for the compliment. i am just a young ignorant wanna be hunter with AR's even though i am 43 and own many other guns.

    I never said i take my AR's big game hunting, but hunting is hunting weather it be squirrels to cape buffalo and a real hunter picks the right weapon for the task at hand.

    I also love shooting and the Ar's are great for that also.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bluey View Post
    gday diamondhitch ,
    ldont believe l was judging a book by its cover mate.
    in america where your semi auto weapons ,are common place .it is l guess acceptable for each and everyone to use / own one or more of these firarms .
    in australia where the only place we see semi auto firearms , is in the militry and police, mate .
    they used to allow them , but a few wankers wanted to be famous and no more of that rubbish needs to be said ,
    where you guys say hunting weapons in australia we say hunting firearms .
    where you guys say millitary weapons , we say assault firearms .
    where you may say its only an assault weapon if used to assault some body
    where in australia our hunting firearms are only weapons when used to assault some body .
    and i rekon if l seen some bloke in fatigues carrying an assalut (millitary ) firearm (weapon ) riffle i'd nearly bet he was a soldier
    look ive already appoligised for the terminology , but i never meant to upset anybody .
    its just the different ways we speak

    and if l was allowed to have one of thgem bad ass looking riffles , dont you worry ,id have some playtime with it in a hart beat .
    Bluey, That was in no way inspired or related to your post. You may have been hit by a stray bullet! LOL
    They are called assault rifles here too which is a constant source of bad press for them. If they were called happy go lucky fun guns would the non-gun totin public even look 2x at them. I think not, that was my point.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doubleriflejack View Post
    As I mentioned above, " I have no problem with the use of sporting fireams, semi-auto or not," though they certainly are not needed. Using them only shows that you are not much of a real hunter, a real " sports hunter." If your goal is just to kill something, you in no way are a sports hunter, in my opinion. Not everyone will fully understand what I mean by this, but the real hunters will.
    Not sure what that means but IMO a sportsman is defined by his conduct not the rifle he carries.

    Quote Originally Posted by sestoppelman View Post
    This is the most "beside the point" post I have seen on this subject. Whether one in the US anyway, chooses to use such a rifle is a matter of choice and should not be legislated simply because of all the silly reasons mentioned above. Whether or not a hunter has served in any military has once again no impact on whether one should use such a rifle for hunting. If its legal and it should be, then whats the big deal? Too many people even on our side fall prey to this stupid notion that because the gun is mostly black, or has the dreaded high cap mag, or the mostly cosmetic dreaded bayonet lug, it should not be ALLOWED to be used for hunting. This is stupid. This idea that something is not "needed" to shoot a deer is equally preposterous! This is the same moronic attitude the left uses against us everyday in America. "Well no one needs an M16 to hunt deer with!" This is a most ridiculous argument. To say that the needle bullet guns are useless for hunting is also beyond silly. The .223 is more than capable of cleanly taking deer sized game and does so every year with proper bullets. I dont know every state game law but I would think that in the states where hunting with an AR rifle is legal, it is probably mandated that mag cap cannot exceed 5 rounds, so that argument is redundant. It just annoys the hell out of me when folks get all butt hurt about so-called assault rifles when the AR15 is no such thing. An actual assault rifle is fully auto capable. How many guys realize that true machine guns are legal in about 38 US states? How many of those legally owned and registered guns are used in crimes each year? Waiting....Thanks 35bore!
    X2 Like many hunting related issues, we need to stand next to each other if we are to defeat the anti-gun anti-hunting crowd. Division over minor details and internal bickering only serves to defeat us.
    The journey is the reward.

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    If'n I was a varmint hunter, i.e. prairie dogs, etc., I'd buy me a 223 prairie dog assault rifle in a heartbeat.

    I do not own an AR, though, but maybe one day. My son wants to buy one, or actually buy him one. he's 23, btw. I told him to save up and buy one for himself.
    I have no use for one....................just yet. Likely never well, except for the sheer joy of plinking with one....... since we don't have prairie dogs in Mississippi.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Diamondhitch View Post
    They are called assault rifles here too which is a constant source of bad press for them.
    now if someone is using their so called "assault rifle" to attack you (militarily speaking), presumably your rifle of the same type becomes a "defensive rifle" preferably with the biggest mag available....? now that sounds better ?

  19. #39
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    Amen to that. The anti-gun crowd are besides themselves with glee when they get hunters and shooters to fight their own. Here in Canada the AR-15 went from a restricted firearm to non-restricted then back to restricted, talk about idiocy. It was my favorite coyote rifle but now is reserved for punching paper thanks to an anti-gun Liberal bureaucracy.

    We had all better hang together or we will surely hang alone. They will pick us off little by little until only the police and military have guns, time to wise up.

    Brian
    Quote Originally Posted by sestoppelman View Post
    This is the most "beside the point" post I have seen on this subject. Whether one in the US anyway, chooses to use such a rifle is a matter of choice and should not be legislated simply because of all the silly reasons mentioned above. Whether or not a hunter has served in any military has once again no impact on whether one should use such a rifle for hunting. If its legal and it should be, then whats the big deal? Too many people even on our side fall prey to this stupid notion that because the gun is mostly black, or has the dreaded high cap mag, or the mostly cosmetic dreaded bayonet lug, it should not be ALLOWED to be used for hunting. This is stupid. This idea that something is not "needed" to shoot a deer is equally preposterous! This is the same moronic attitude the left uses against us everyday in America. "Well no one needs an M16 to hunt deer with!" This is a most ridiculous argument. To say that the needle bullet guns are useless for hunting is also beyond silly. The .223 is more than capable of cleanly taking deer sized game and does so every year with proper bullets. I dont know every state game law but I would think that in the states where hunting with an AR rifle is legal, it is probably mandated that mag cap cannot exceed 5 rounds, so that argument is redundant. It just annoys the hell out of me when folks get all butt hurt about so-called assault rifles when the AR15 is no such thing. An actual assault rifle is fully auto capable. How many guys realize that true machine guns are legal in about 38 US states? How many of those legally owned and registered guns are used in crimes each year? Waiting....Thanks 35bore!

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    Alright, bored and drinking. That "yard arm" thing again.

    Here is A SALT rifle....

    A SALT rifle.jpg
    "That which does not kill us makes us stronger" Friedrich Nietzsche // That which does not kill me, better run like hell" Scott Smith

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