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458 win mag rifle choices CZ 550 vs Winchester 70

This is a discussion on 458 win mag rifle choices CZ 550 vs Winchester 70 within the .375 & Up forums, part of the HUNTING EQUIPMENT, FIREARMS & AMMUNITION category; Originally Posted by bebo 35bore told : " I will always lean toward the CZ for a CRF rifle, ........ ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by bebo View Post
    35bore told :

    " I will always lean toward the CZ for a CRF rifle, ........ I owned one Winchester rifle........ then sold it for a push feed"

    Why do you prefer PF than CRF ? The security is better with a CRF system no ?
    bebo,

    Never actually said that I prefer PF over CRF, was just answering the OP question. I feel the CZ is a much better rifle, you get a quality firearm with acuracy right out of the box. The Winchester 70 I had, I paid approx $680 for, accuracy wasnt bad, but not great. I ended up sinking another $150 into it (glass bedding and pillars) helped with accuracy some. I tried about 10 differnt types of ammo in that thing. That's when I cut my loses and traded it for a Remington 700 in the same caliber, 1st box of ammo were Core Lokt and I had a nice little cloverleaf on the target.

    Likewise, the CZ 550 in 416 Rigby using Federal premium 400 bullets preformed (on paper) the same as the Remington 700, nice tight group. That's why I recomended the CZ

    All that being said, you were correct in your assumption that I prefer push feed. The argument between PF vs. CRF has been argued by better and more knowledgeable men that me. I have worked a Remington 700/m-40 in all kinds of precarious rifle positions, and have never had any issues. The PF rifles (again in my opinion) can be and are just as reliable as a CRF. as long as the shooter KNOWS his rifle, which should be the case anyway. The best agrgument/discussion I have been fortunate enough to be involved in was with an older gentleman who made the statement that" the claw extractor on a model 70 is so strong, that if the case got stuck in the chamber, it would rip the headstamp off before it let go"..... My reply, "Okay so now you have a rifle you can't chamber another round into because there's a large chunk of brass in the chamber".

    Again for me it's a personal choice, to others it's taboo. Whatever, regardless, so on and so forth. If the 458 wm on the Mauser action I am having is not accurate, I will be selling it and buying a CZ 550 as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 35bore View Post
    bebo,

    Never actually said that I prefer PF over CRF, was just answering the OP question. I feel the CZ is a much better rifle, you get a quality firearm with acuracy right out of the box. The Winchester 70 I had, I paid approx $680 for, accuracy wasnt bad, but not great. I ended up sinking another $150 into it (glass bedding and pillars) helped with accuracy some. I tried about 10 differnt types of ammo in that thing. That's when I cut my loses and traded it for a Remington 700 in the same caliber, 1st box of ammo were Core Lokt and I had a nice little cloverleaf on the target.

    Likewise, the CZ 550 in 416 Rigby using Federal premium 400 bullets preformed (on paper) the same as the Remington 700, nice tight group. That's why I recomended the CZ

    All that being said, you were correct in your assumption that I prefer push feed. The argument between PF vs. CRF has been argued by better and more knowledgeable men that me. I have worked a Remington 700/m-40 in all kinds of precarious rifle positions, and have never had any issues. The PF rifles (again in my opinion) can be and are just as reliable as a CRF. as long as the shooter KNOWS his rifle, which should be the case anyway. The best agrgument/discussion I have been fortunate enough to be involved in was with an older gentleman who made the statement that" the claw extractor on a model 70 is so strong, that if the case got stuck in the chamber, it would rip the headstamp off before it let go"..... My reply, "Okay so now you have a rifle you can't chamber another round into because there's a large chunk of brass in the chamber".

    Again for me it's a personal choice, to others it's taboo. Whatever, regardless, so on and so forth. If the 458 wm on the Mauser action I am having is not accurate, I will be selling it and buying a CZ 550 as well.
    Your opinion is interesting about PF vs CRF. Long time ago I 've owned a Rem 700 Safari .375 H&H never problem.

    I m surprised about the accuracy of your Winch 70 , mines are perfect (the both : .375 H&H and .416 RM) .375 H&H, Leupold VX2 4-9x40 Zero @ 190 yds ++, inside 3" max .The rifle can do better, me no !!
    Today I have not enough experience with the .416 RM to give a valuable opinion.

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    I think Phoenix Phil and sestoppelman have stated before that a lot of problems with guns and accuracy can be pinned to bad bedding of a rifle and I can't disagree. A good stock with a solid bedding helps with cycling of the action and accuracy of the barrel not influencing shots. Don't ever underestimate bad triggers too!

    I honestly can only say one bad thing about one Remington 700, a BDL in a 270 Win.(it had a terrible stock, with terrible bedding). With a new gun stock, a Bell and Carson...it shot and cycled fine. Most of the push feed Remingtons I have shot are super accurate and cycle flawlessly. As a deer rifle I have no problem with a push feed gun. If I was hunting something that could stomp or eat me...I would want to make damn sure I had a gun and scope that would not let me down....and most sensible people on here would too. That is why most people hunt dangerous game with a control feed rifle or a double rifle.

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    Quote Originally Posted by enysse View Post
    I think Phoenix Phil and sestoppelman have stated before that a lot of problems with guns and accuracy can be pinned to bad bedding of a rifle and I can't disagree. A good stock with a solid bedding helps with cycling of the action and accuracy of the barrel not influencing shots. Don't ever underestimate bad triggers too!

    I honestly can only say one bad thing about one Remington 700, a BDL in a 270 Win.(it had a terrible stock, with terrible bedding). With a new gun stock, a Bell and Carson...it shot and cycled fine. Most of the push feed Remingtons I have shot are super accurate and cycle flawlessly. As a deer rifle I have no problem with a push feed gun. If I was hunting something that could stomp or eat me...I would want to make damn sure I had a gun and scope that would not let me down....and most sensible people on here would too. That is why most people hunt dangerous game with a control feed rifle or a double rifle.
    Again, my intention was not to turn this into a PF vs. CRF debate, not at all. I actually was just showing preference to the CZ over the Win 70 based on personal experience. (I owned all of 1 Winchester model 70) and had no luck, but a lot of frustration. I have owned 2 Ruger model 77's, (1) 375 H&H (2) 458 Win Mag, both shot better than the Winchester but not as good as the CZ. Hell, I had a double rifle BP in 50 cal that shot better than the Winchester (go figure). All of you know, or should know I am partial to the 700's so I will always stand by them regardless if it's PG or DG I have no doubts that they will preform as long as I do my part in cycling the action.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 35bore View Post
    Again, my intention was not to turn this into a PF vs. CRF debate, not at all. I actually was just showing preference to the CZ over the Win 70 based on personal experience. (I owned all of 1 Winchester model 70) and had no luck, but a lot of frustration. I have owned 2 Ruger model 77's, (1) 375 H&H (2) 458 Win Mag, both shot better than the Winchester but not as good as the CZ. Hell, I had a double rifle BP in 50 cal that shot better than the Winchester (go figure). All of you know, or should know I am partial to the 700's so I will always stand by them regardless if it's PG or DG I have no doubts that they will preform as long as I do my part in cycling the action.
    I can't help but wonder if you got a somewhat older M70 when quality at Winchester was up and down. The rifles from the FN plan in South Carolina from my experience with a .375H&H and a .300WM are out of the box shooters. I have several loads that are MOA or better for both. That said, Winchester's bedding job from the factory is not the best. However for my .375, I truly don't care. I've done nothing to that rifle.

    I've got nothing against Remington. But for your own sake, don't buy one a Walmart. I've read about all sorts of problems with them and advised a friend not to buy one. He did and was sorry. It was a 7mm Magnum that he bought for his son last Christmas. First go at the range, the rifle would not extract spent rounds. Gunsmith says the bolt was machined incorrectly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PHOENIX PHIL View Post
    I can't help but wonder if you got a somewhat older M70 when quality at Winchester was up and down. The rifles from the FN plan in South Carolina from my experience with a .375H&H and a .300WM are out of the box shooters. I have several loads that are MOA or better for both. That said, Winchester's bedding job from the factory is not the best. However for my .375, I truly don't care. I've done nothing to that rifle.

    I've got nothing against Remington. But for your own sake, don't buy one a Walmart. I've read about all sorts of problems with them and advised a friend not to buy one. He did and was sorry. It was a 7mm Magnum that he bought for his son last Christmas. First go at the range, the rifle would not extract spent rounds. Gunsmith says the bolt was machined incorrectly.
    Trust me, I DO NOT buy firearms at Wal Mart (there are too many awesome local gun shops to buy from). The model 70 was built after FN took over production. It shot decent enough (30-06) and did so about the first 3 range sessions, then accuracy went to crap. Thorough cleanings every time, changed bases, changed scopes. Figured it was either in the bedding or barrel, so I had it glass bedded with the aluminum pillars. Nothing helped, so as I previously stated I got rid of it for a 700 and sucked up my loses on the 70. That's all. Could have just been a bad apple in the bunch, but it was my bad apple and it tasted like crap.
    "That which does not kill us makes us stronger" Friedrich Nietzsche // That which does not kill me, better run like hell" Scott Smith

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