404 Jeffery vs 375 H&H
So I've been looking at lots of guns for my and my daughters upcoming Safari, I had pretty much settled on a 375 for both of us or 300mag or 30-06 for her IF the 375 was too stiff. BUT Ive always kind of wanted a 404 Jeff just becasue. Something about saying 'yeah, that ones a 404 Jeffery", just makes me smile :-)
I plan to hand load anyway, so that's not an issues, AND I just found a really nice CZ 550 with great wood in 404 Jeff, so Id like to know what the common thoughts are on the 404 Jeff and if recoil is that much worse than a 375. I can handle "big SHOVE" type recoil all day long, but sharp "PUNCH!" recoil is harder for me to tolerate with no flinch due to an old rotator cuff blow out that I never had surgically corrected.
Id say If I can handle the 404 Jeff, that'll be my "big gun"
Brakes and mercury reducers are always an option, but Ill shoot them first to get a feel for it, I currently shoot a 450 Marlin with hot loads in a 7lb lever gun and can handle that well enough with no flinch. I figure a 404 in a 10 lb gun should be a bit milder as recoil velocity and recoil ft lbs are very close between the two.
Thoughts on both the Jeff in general and recoil of it vs 375?
thanks all :D
I would say go for it! There should not be that much difference...especially if you can handle a 450 Marlin.
I`d second enysse, Just gone for the 404 myself
The opportunity is in your hands for a great gun...
i have to agree with the others to go with it.
You did not indicate what animals you would be hunting?....or if dangerous game is on your ticket...
Or what country you will be hunting in.
I would say a 338 win mag or 375 H & H would be a fine match to your 404 Jeff. for almost any safari you can think of.
Your daughter on the other hand is another subject...recommend what you have in the closet to go along with your 338 or 375.
Now if you are looking to purchase a rifle for her i would suggest a 300 win mag or 300 H & H with 180 gr projectiles.
I really like rifle shopping...
Ive settled on a new CZ in 404 Jeff and a second in either 375 H&H or 300 Win Mag
I made some calls today and can get a CZ 550 Safari Classic with the grade A wood new for less than the used one if I wait for the SCI show in Vegas, so thats a no brainer.
My daughter's a good shooter and avid hunter, I would not feel right giving her a "closet" gun
If shes going on Safari with me, she gets a new rifle too :cool:, it'll be matched set :D
We already have Marlin 1895 GGs in 450 and 45-70 that match (hers is cut down a bit though) which are our hog guns.
It looks like IM kinda leaning towards Limpopo and surrounding areas, game for this trip will be strictly plains game, some of the bigger ones for sure probably, but not dangerous game. My plan is to use the 404 for everything save mebbe longer shots when She'll use the 375 or 300
On future safaris I plan to use the 404 as well for dangerous game, unless thats just really unwise, but as the 375 is legal for DG (yes?) and the 404 is a bit stouter, seems it'd be OK with solids. Shot placement, Shot placement, Shot placement, no? :D
Other opinions welcome, thanks for the feedback
I think your thinking is very logical.
The Limpopo Province is very rich in wildlife. Hunts are afforadable. And since it's easier to save for a hunt there, it makes the hunt more enjoyable. Unless a outfitter has cut "senderos" in the brush...shots won't be that far. The accomodations, food and people in the area are really good.
I think the main thing is to practice with the guns you are going to use...off of sticks or free hand. I would bring the 45-70 too!
Yeah, Ive thought of brining the 450 and the 45-70 both. Great short range punch and quick follow up shots, plus easy handling.
Perfect brush guns IMHO
I'm not sure how much real difference there is in recoil, and if you hand load you can do whatever you want to anyway. I figure if my wife can put on high heels every night to look great, I can deal with a touch of extra recoil for a millisecond every so often so that I can be the guy with the 404. Not sure what appeals to me about it, but there it is.
^^^ Well spoken Bert, well spoken, how very true! LOL :rofl:
Ditto what others have said. The .404 is a big fav of mine and I too have the CZ and it shoots great. See the pics of it on my page. Recoil in my mind is certainly no worse than my lighter .375 and also due to a much better pad on the CZ. A .423 caliber 400 gr bullet is going to hit harder than any .375 to be sure so no worries about its abilities. Its had a great reputation for many many years using loads that were less powerful than what we have today and before handloading. Its as good as the .416 Rigby any day if velocities are boosted a bit over factory (old) speeds of around 2050 fps. One can easily get over 2400 fps which is right where the Rigby sits. Its a great round!! Have confidence in it.
I have, and have used, both the 375 and the 404J. For dangerous game I would go with the 404, hands down. For plains game you really don't need anything bigger than the 375. Dead is dead and the 375 kills plains game period. If I were you, I would take both the 375 and the 404. I would use the 375 as my primary plains game rifle but take an eland/ zebra/ wildebeest/ etc with the 404. When you go back for Dangerous game take both again and use your 404 as primary and 375 as backup and for plains game. I have a cz 404J safari classic and love it.
I think Ive settled on the following for the safari battery
300 win mag-bolt gun (or mebbe a 30-06 as this will be my daughters primary/open country gun)
404 jeff-bolt gun ( my primary/open country gun)
45-70-lever with moderate loads (daughters secondary/brush gun)
450 marlin-lever with heavy loads (my secondary/brush gun)
Ive booked a hunt in June with Chris Troskey and am pretty stoked!
Too many guns, extra paperwork, ammo, baggage. You only need an '06 and the .404, it will cover everything quite nicely. You will have no need of "secondary brush guns".
A valid point and something Ive considered. I may drop one of the leverguns out of the battery, OR mebbe the 06. It will largely depend on what my daughter is most comfortable with. But I def am taking at least one levergun, just becasue. Damn the paperwork/fees/ammo It a friggin Safari and I'm going half way across the world and spending a bunch of money to do it, Im not about to leave something behind that Id like to use becasue of additional paperwork :D
You picked a terrific outfitter!!! You are going to have a great trip!
^^ Yeah, I kind of hated to put a deposit down before going to SCI in Vegas, BUT Chris had the time frame I needed available, pricing was fair, and Ive seen some great reviews and had great feedback on him. Plus we want to do one or two days on horseback, so that works out too.
I have a friend making his 3rd trip with Trosky in April, very happy with him. On the gun thing, it is of course your trip and you can take anything you want to. I just think you will find it adds a lot of bother to your trip, not just from the paperwork but also the other things I mentioned. But hey, have at it.
^^ appreciate the input for sure, and I may yet whittle it down to 2 guns.
I just dont really want too LOL ;)
Depending on what country you are going 2 guns are your limit
Originally Posted by mtcraigco
Stupid rules! Forgot about that LOL